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Thread: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

  1. #71
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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    And you aren't operating from a mindless stereotype?? Then why did you bring up me defending the rich and demonizing the working class, when I never said any such thing ?? I guess it's okay of you as a liberal to be mindless …

    Here is the problem with the states, they have over 2 trillion dollars of debt from just the unions pension funds … they unlike our federal government by state law “must” pass balanced budgets, also unlike the feds they can't just print the money to get them by. So cuts must be made .. and what better place to cut then where much of the problem lies ?
    As I said before I believe the layoff of teachers was just a political slam to get back at Walker, it seems that other districts managed their cuts and didn't need to lay anyone off
    If you want to find fault with why those pensions are causing so much trouble … there is enough to go around .. teachers and government alike .. lets not forget who we are dealing with here .. these are teachers .. they should know better then most when something is economically sound, or were they just to greedy to worry about it? Government rather then standing up to the unions just caved and gave them what they wanted .. passing the buck down the road with creative book keeping and lies to keep getting elected ..
    The bottom line is when you have two parties that don't care about the kids .. or the future and are only interesting in what they can get ….. it has to end sometime .. and that time has turned out to be now..... and now cuts have to be made … and the proof is in the fact that there are Democratic controlled states that are cutting as well.
    I brought it up aas a response to your mindless sterotype effort. I had hoped that you would see how silly it was. Instead, you just dug into the sterotype.

    While I don't accept that teacher poensions are as large a problem as you accept, I would argue if that is the problem, address that problem. yes, there is enough blame to go around, but so far the solutions have been to hurt not only teachers, but children, as classes will likely be larger, less money for them, as the system hasn't been touched, and nothing done to spend smarter, not more.

    Now, while I can't say neither party cares about children, I can say they respond more to pressure from special intest groups than to the actual issues. This leaves business and unions dong more and getting more than children are. While unions are no more evil than business leaders, harming us not one bit more, thus no more deserving of anyone's rage than business, the fact is our leaders should be above both, and geared more toward problem solving. What I argue here is about us, what do we value? If we value education and children, we should not accept these blind, untarget cuts and should demand more, demand a plan.

    If you want to run around demonizing liberals, all the while not seeing how easily you can be demonized by your support of business, I can't stop you. But do try to see what I'm actually arguing.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I brought it up aas a response to your mindless sterotype effort. I had hoped that you would see how silly it was. Instead, you just dug into the sterotype.

    While I don't accept that teacher poensions are as large a problem as you accept, I would argue if that is the problem, address that problem. yes, there is enough blame to go around, but so far the solutions have been to hurt not only teachers, but children, as classes will likely be larger, less money for them, as the system hasn't been touched, and nothing done to spend smarter, not more.

    Now, while I can't say neither party cares about children, I can say they respond more to pressure from special intest groups than to the actual issues. This leaves business and unions dong more and getting more than children are. While unions are no more evil than business leaders, harming us not one bit more, thus no more deserving of anyone's rage than business, the fact is our leaders should be above both, and geared more toward problem solving. What I argue here is about us, what do we value? If we value education and children, we should not accept these blind, untarget cuts and should demand more, demand a plan.

    If you want to run around demonizing liberals, all the while not seeing how easily you can be demonized by your support of business, I can't stop you. But do try to see what I'm actually arguing.
    -chuckles- you just can't stop can you ? Wisconson and other states are doing just that .. addressing the problem of over 2 trillion dollars of debt from the union pension funds ...addressing the problems of less income because of lower home values, and loss revenue because of the higher rate of unemployment .. they are addressing that problem by cutting spending. Much the same as any responsible person would do with his own budget when or if he was to have his income lowered ...

    Now are you denying that the liberal policy has always been tax and spend ??

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    -chuckles- you just can't stop can you ? Wisconson and other states are doing just that .. addressing the problem of over 2 trillion dollars of debt from the union pension funds ...addressing the problems of less income because of lower home values, and loss revenue because of the higher rate of unemployment .. they are addressing that problem by cutting spending. Much the same as any responsible person would do with his own budget when or if he was to have his income lowered ...

    Now are you denying that the liberal policy has always been tax and spend ??
    No, they really are not, at least not effectively. What we see here is just a cut, costing jobs, and not addressing the issues. And actually, responsible people don't just cut spending. They often attack revenue as well. I have at times took a second job to add revenue, and I doubt I'm the only one. Attacking one side of the issue is not often as effective as attacking both.

    Well, I would deny that only liberals spend. Frankly, both parties spend. And I would consider tax and spend much preferable to tax cut and spend.

    And I wouldn add, if I had to choose between which spending I prefer, I prefer the money spent here, on our teachers, our students, our health care than building up nations in Afghanistan and Iraq. Values. What do you value?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    (CNN) -- In a budget-cutting move likely to be echoed around the country, Milwaukee Public Schools said Wednesday it will lay off 519 staff members -- including 354 teachers -- because of $84 million in state cuts and the system's efforts to control costs.

    Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers - CNN.com

    Cuts have consequences.
    This is what I don't get. We know that the teachers pay has a mimumal effect on budget, and it is in fact administrative cost that lead to the exploding educational budget. This is caused by everyone wanting their own "district." Why not just combine all the small districts and fire people who are, in effect, useless and an actual drain on the system? All firing teachers will do is make bad schools worse and make good school bad.
    Hayek - too liberal for republicans

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    This is what I don't get. We know that the teachers pay has a mimumal effect on budget, and it is in fact administrative cost that lead to the exploding educational budget. This is caused by everyone wanting their own "district." Why not just combine all the small districts and fire people who are, in effect, useless and an actual drain on the system? All firing teachers will do is make bad schools worse and make good school bad.
    I could support something like that. Any idea why it isn't proposed?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I could support something like that. Any idea why it isn't proposed?
    Because administrators are the ones with power and it easier to whip the weak. That and everyone believes that pure local control is something to be strived for. However, what I just said is purposed by those who want actual education reform. Bob Bennte, superintendent of public school in Indy, has purposed such a measure (hes republican)
    Hayek - too liberal for republicans

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    Because administrators are the ones with power and it easier to whip the weak. That and everyone believes that pure local control is something to be strived for. However, what I just said is purposed by those who want actual education reform. Bob Bennte, superintendent of public school in Indy, has purposed such a measure (hes republican)
    Good for him. Like I said, I could support that.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    So, instead of bowing before the alter of mindless sterotypes, how about you think just a little more, and ask that you leaders do more than just cut, but instead have a plan, a real plan, one that does more good than harm. Ask that they invest proeprly, in what we value, as that is what our investments speak to, what we truely value.
    California spends more than 50% of the entire budget on education every year, yet we rank 47th in the states in education level. When is enough....enough?
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    California spends more than 50% of the entire budget on education every year, yet we rank 47th in the states in education level. When is enough....enough?
    Again, I have no issue with a plan to spend more wisely. I have an issue with just cutting funds. Just cutting is no better than just spending.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post
    California spends more than 50% of the entire budget on education every year, yet we rank 47th in the states in education level. When is enough....enough?
    When its actually spent on education.
    Hayek - too liberal for republicans

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