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Thread: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

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    Professor xpiher's Avatar
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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So taking away the kids in DC's vouchers so they can go back to their crappy schools is supposed to help them?

    j-mac
    No, paying for their transportation to the good school would though. The problem with the repub approach to the voucher system is that they typically do not look at the entire picture and simply stick with "it will make everything better in the long run" Sure, thats great, what about the short run where kids are left in the dust and become criminals due to poor education due to a failure of the system thats been brought up but never addressed because "we can't afford it"

    I have had a debate with Tony Bennett, IN's superintendent of public instruction. I brought up the transportation issue, he didn't have a solution, said it was good that I brought up, but we should get the vouchers going anyways. You know what doing things half-assed usually does right - Never getting the problem fixed.

    All we do by allowing people to transfer out of school, without anything in placed to help those kids left in the bad ones, is a bigger mess because it will make the disparity that much harder. You also don't fix the problem of the good school denying entrance to the "bad kids"
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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    No, paying for their transportation to the good school would though. The problem with the repub approach to the voucher system is that they typically do not look at the entire picture and simply stick with "it will make everything better in the long run" Sure, thats great, what about the short run where kids are left in the dust and become criminals due to poor education due to a failure of the system thats been brought up but never addressed because "we can't afford it"

    I have had a debate with Tony Bennett, IN's superintendent of public instruction. I brought up the transportation issue, he didn't have a solution, said it was good that I brought up, but we should get the vouchers going anyways. You know what doing things half-assed usually does right - Never getting the problem fixed.

    All we do by allowing people to transfer out of school, without anything in placed to help those kids left in the bad ones, is a bigger mess because it will make the disparity that much harder. You also don't fix the problem of the good school denying entrance to the "bad kids"
    The problem I see here is that you seem to be arguing that if all the kids can't have the "good" have to suffer with the sub standard instead of bringing all boats up, you bring the ones floating under with you.

    j-mac
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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Aren't these charters exactly what liberals and Obama are attacking?

    j-mac
    Obama is for Charter schools. I'm not, not as a cure all, as some conservatives present them. Like vouchers, they are only better when they don't have to tackle the same problems.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    So taking away the kids in DC's vouchers so they can go back to their crappy schools is supposed to help them?

    j-mac

    No, simply put, you don't have a better school. The schools are only better when they can be selective, have a select population over all. Nothing done it private schools or charter schools is actually that much different than in public schools. Your belief that the schools are better is misguided overall. A particular school might have better outcomes, but that is likley because it has a population with less problems, and the success would vanish with more from the general population.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    No, paying for their transportation to the good school would though.
    No it doesn't, it just creates a cultural conflict.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, simply put, you don't have a better school. The schools are only better when they can be selective, have a select population over all. Nothing done it private schools or charter schools is actually that much different than in public schools. Your belief that the schools are better is misguided overall. A particular school might have better outcomes, but that is likley because it has a population with less problems, and the success would vanish with more from the general population.
    Man, what a load of BS that is....It documented dude.

    j-mac
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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Man, what a load of BS that is....It documented dude.

    j-mac
    Actually, j, it's not what you think it is. There are studies shwoing that when the populations are the same, the results are the same. You take things at face value without digging deeper to see why.

    But I challenge you to show me the magic methodology they use. If they are different, show the difference. I deal with teachers from all sectors. They do the same ****. Sorry.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Actually, j, it's not what you think it is. There are studies shwoing that when the populations are the same, the results are the same. You take things at face value without digging deeper to see why.

    But I challenge you to show me the magic methodology they use. If they are different, show the difference. I deal with teachers from all sectors. They do the same ****. Sorry.
    Sorry Joe, you have a proven tendency to cherry pick that data which shows that which you would like the narrative to be. So it doesn't hold water.

    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Sorry Joe, you have a proven tendency to cherry pick that data which shows that which you would like the narrative to be. So it doesn't hold water.

    j-mac
    Well, I'll over look the pot to kettle thingie, but I have challenged you to show me what they do differently. I suggest they have a different population if if they have the same population would do just as poorly.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Well, I'll over look the pot to kettle thingie, but I have challenged you to show me what they do differently. I suggest they have a different population if if they have the same population would do just as poorly.
    Start here...

    There are many benefits to attending a charter school one main benefit is that innovative systems allow for a unique way of educating. Because of school choice the parent and the student are more likely to be involved in the commitment to the school. Another pro for to charter school is the competition. Charter schools must work to maintain their academic performance, student’s retention, and finances. Another pro to charter schools act as a catalyst for improvement of the public system.

    The American School/Charter vs. Public Schools - Wikibooks, open books for an open world

    j-mac
    Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.

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