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Thread: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

  1. #171
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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by buck View Post
    The districts that planned, aren't cutting teachers. Instead they are adding teachers in addition to giving an extra class to the teachers, resulting in reduced class sizes.

    Districts that wanted to protect the unions and ignore reality are having to cut teachers. You'll have to talk to them to find out why they made the decisions they made.

    However, the reduced teachers and increased class sizes (in the case of MPS) will only be for 2 years. in 2 years when the contract they (incredulously) signed expires, they will be able to reduce class sizes again.
    First, thanks for answering the question. This was a decent answer. I appreciate that.

    Now, this again seems up to districts, if you're correct. Which is a little to ad hoc to be a very good plan, imho. Secondly, two years of overcrowded classrooms isn't a plus.


    Millions of public school students across the nation are seeing their class sizes swell because of budget cuts and teacher layoffs, undermining a decades-long push by parents, administrators and policy makers to shrink class sizes.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/07/ed...lassrooms.html

    “When you have a class size that’s even 40, it’s too large,” Kobaissi said. “You can never really get to each student and find out their needs and weaknesses. Oftentimes, with a class like 56, it’s hard even to be personal enough to memorize all their names.”

    Teacher layoffs raise class-size tensions | Tihik.Com News

    Class sizes will more than likely increase since the layoffs include 354 teachers, and students will undoubtedly be using old textbooks, according to Superintendent Gregory Thornton.

    These drastic cuts are a result of Gov. Scott Walker’s two-year budget plan which was signed on Sunday. This plan cut spending to schools by approximately $200 less per student. With roughly 82,000 students attending Milwaukee Public Schools, this plan cut $182,000 from their district’s budget.

    Ouch, right? The sad truth is that these kinds of cuts are occurring everywhere in our nation. Let’s look at Detroit where they face the same difficult dilemma but were able to find an alternative to laying off teachers.

    Teacher World » Milwaukee and Detroit Public Schools’ Budget Cuts Announced

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  2. #172
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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, it doesn't address the complaint, the objection. Now, he or you could try and do that, which would be a nice change.
    okay you go first for a change .. how do you account for other districts "not laying off teachers" and one district going from a deficit .. to a surplus under Walkers plan ?

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I don't believe we said there wasn't. The comment was more along the lines of the effort was suppose to keep teacher jobs. This was not done.
    Oh really ??? here is exactly what was said ..

    "Didn't the Wisconsin governor bust up unions to prevent thse types of cuts? "

    your reply "Apparently not, no "

    Now what union was busted .. . gonna answer . . or continue with your lies ..

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    Oh really ??? here is exactly what was said ..

    "Didn't the Wisconsin governor bust up unions to prevent thse types of cuts? "

    your reply "Apparently not, no "

    Now what union was busted .. . gonna answer . . or continue with your lies ..
    Busted up doesn't mean gone. They took a beating. They were busted up. Teacher jobs have been lost.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    okay you go first for a change .. how do you account for other districts "not laying off teachers" and one district going from a deficit .. to a surplus under Walkers plan ?
    You might want to read my answer to Buck. I would expect a plan not to leave it up to districts to decide, as that is not a plan but passing the buck. If it leaves us with any district cutting teachers and thus increasing class size, we have failed to have a proper plan.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Busted up doesn't mean gone. They took a beating. They were busted up. Teacher jobs have been lost.
    were they lost ... . or given up to continue the assault on Walker .. after all if no teachers would have lost their jobs .. how could this continue to be a big issue .

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    You might want to read my answer to Buck. I would expect a plan not to leave it up to districts to decide, as that is not a plan but passing the buck. If it leaves us with any district cutting teachers and thus increasing class size, we have failed to have a proper plan.
    So in your opinion . When spending cuts are involved .. it's a bad plan to allow the districts … to decide how they should handle those cuts .. Who would know better the needs .. of a particular school .. that district .. or the government that could be located 100s of miles away ???

    IMO it was the right thing to do to have the districts handle the cuts .. they are more involved in their community and should know their needs better.

    What to me it shows .. is that some districts choose to abide by the cuts .. and do the best they could with them .. while others used it as a political tool .. to get back at Walker .. by disregarding the kids and teachers and going straight to lay offs. Of course in your opinion .. it's better to lay teacher off then look at all other options .. to make sure that you and other libs can continue the assault on Walker

    Thank you for the post on Detroit's handling of the cuts .. It seems that they managed their budget cuts with laying off teachers … perhaps it would have been wise of Milwaukee to do something similar ..or even call Detroit for help with their budgeting before going to lay offs of teachers .. but then again .. if the budget cuts went without lay offs .. it would be harder to continue the bashing of Walker which is your and other liberals primary concern

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    were they lost ... . or given up to continue the assault on Walker .. after all if no teachers would have lost their jobs .. how could this continue to be a big issue .
    How were they lost? Please, explain.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    You might want to read my answer to Buck. I would expect a plan not to leave it up to districts to decide, as that is not a plan but passing the buck. If it leaves us with any district cutting teachers and thus increasing class size, we have failed to have a proper plan.
    The individual School districts are responsible for the budgeting of the schools. The governor can not (and I am glad for it) make those decisions. The governor can only provide money to school districts to do what they want with it.

    In this case, some districts decided they wanted to give it to unions/teachers and the unions decided they wouldn't make any concessions for the benefit of all. In other cases, the districts(rightly) decided to use the new tools made available from the governor (teacher contribute to pensions, moving away from the vastly overpriced WEA insurance, etc).

    I know why some districts decided to do what they did. Now, students will be disadvantaged due to their decisions (for two years in the case of milwaukee).
    Last edited by buck; 07-05-11 at 07:31 PM.

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    Re: Milwaukee schools to lay off 354 teachers

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    So in your opinion . When spending cuts are involved .. it's a bad plan to allow the districts … to decide how they should handle those cuts .. Who would know better the needs .. of a particular school .. that district .. or the government that could be located 100s of miles away ???

    IMO it was the right thing to do to have the districts handle the cuts .. they are more involved in their community and should know their needs better.

    What to me it shows .. is that some districts choose to abide by the cuts .. and do the best they could with them .. while others used it as a political tool .. to get back at Walker .. by disregarding the kids and teachers and going straight to lay offs. Of course in your opinion .. it's better to lay teacher off then look at all other options .. to make sure that you and other libs can continue the assault on Walker

    Thank you for the post on Detroit's handling of the cuts .. It seems that they managed their budget cuts with laying off teachers … perhaps it would have been wise of Milwaukee to do something similar ..or even call Detroit for help with their budgeting before going to lay offs of teachers .. but then again .. if the budget cuts went without lay offs .. it would be harder to continue the bashing of Walker which is your and other liberals primary concern
    It's a bad plan to cut teachers and increase class size. We facing cuts here, and we argued that it was important to get feedback, to involve everyone in the decisions, but that those charged with making sure the mission was met, you know, making sure students got the best possible education, had to have final say.

    Here you seem to be arguing that if a district wants to harm children, good for them. I say, no, any plan at budget cuts must assure that children are not the ones paying the price.

    Now, a hammer tends to see everythign as a nail, so a political partisan tends to see everything as policial, so it doesn't surprise me that you see this as a political tool to get back at Walker. You overlook that Walker did not present a play that would assure teachers stayed working. I seriously doubt those who got pink slips said please fire me.

    Yes, I personally prefer Detroit's choice over Milwaukee's. Still, I suspect we could have done a better job in both places.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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