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New York to Become the Sixth State to Legalize Gay Marriage

NGNM85 said:
Nonsense. One cannot create rights, one can merely respect rights.
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that's great.

someone can yell & scream all they like about this right and that right, but unless society recognizes such a right, its meaningless.
 
ARealConservative said:
I agree but this becomes semantics. the 44 states that do not allow gay marriage is argued to be a violation of rights, which I largely agree is a loss of rights. but based on your semantic definition, it isn't.
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this is a fact. at the present time, the majority of American states do NOT recognize or acknowledge the right of gay folks to get married.

NY has chosen to recognize such a right, while NJ has not.

Do I believe that NJ is therefore violating the rights of gay people? No, I do not. However, I would not shed a tear of tomorrow NJ decides to recognize this right.

Like I said, rights only exist when a society decides to recognize them.
 
Your Star said:
Unless your really old it's gonna happen in your lifetime. I'd say within this decade.
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lol, two things: First, I am really old. :mrgreen: Second, it won't happen as long as there is a 5-4 conservative majority on SCOTUS.
 
Thunder said:
that's great.

someone can yell & scream all they like about this right and that right, but unless society recognizes such a right, its meaningless.
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It's not meaningless, it just doesn't necessarily change anything. Russians or the Chinese aren't less entitled, Westerners don't have a special monopoly on civil rights, they just, unfortunately, like in oppressive police states that systematically violate these rights. The only way to, quite rightfully, condemn these regimes is to acknowledge this, and, by so doing, that rights exist outside the law, which can respect them, or not. For an example; Murder isn't wrong simply because it's illegal, it's fundamentally wrong, therefore, it is often legally prohibited.
 
DiAnna said:
lol, two things: First, I am really old. :mrgreen: Second, it won't happen as long as there is a 5-4 conservative majority on SCOTUS.
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You can't be that old ;)

And I could see them voting in favor of it based on conservatives principals, like getting the government out of the peoples business.
 
You know, a picture is worth a thousand words, or even a thousand posts in a thread:

5867979817_203c0da4db.jpg
 
DiAnna said:
lol, two things: First, I am really old. :mrgreen: Second, it won't happen as long as there is a 5-4 conservative majority on SCOTUS.
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The decisions on DOMA out of Massachusetts where designed with a conservative viewpoint in mind. States rights is a very important viewpoint of conservative judges, and the DOMA case rides on states rights as an issue. The federal government cannot say it will not recognize a contract the states have a right to enact.
 
Thunder said:
Religions are more than welcome to and can legally discriminate against, same-sex marriages. At least according to NY State law.
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religion can basically discriminate against anyone on anything on RELIGIOUS matters and tahts according to the constitution.

WHen people act like this right is in jeopardy its just a deflection to act like theres a real reason to not give equal rights to gays.
 
ARealConservative said:
the biggest effects will be on:

1 employers. If they provide any spousal coverage, they will be forced to offer coverage to gay spouses - even if it violates their individual views on the issue.

2 social security - the costs will certainly increase from opening up benefit sharing.

I really think #1 should be handled legislatively granting private sector employers the freedom to discriminate.
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this is insane and goes against everything american.
 
Thunder said:
what happens if all the employers in a state decide they don't want to hire Jews?

are Jews supposed to just die?
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lol. is this a serious question?
 
Centrist77 said:
this is insane and goes against everything american.
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nonsense. rights that everyone agrees with doesn't need protection. The ones most in need of our protection are the controversial ones. This is a distinctly American concept.
 
Thunder said:
its an honest question.

if you believe that employers have the right to discriminate, what is an ethnicity or racial group supposed to do if all the employers in a state decide to not hire anyone from that group?
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first off, if the population base is so full of bigotry against a particular subset of people, you aren't going to find any legislative help for them in the first place, so the notion that we could solve such a problem politically is a non-starter. Hence me laughing at this absurdity. if everyone hates the group to that level, they will have no protection in the courts.

but if such an absurd hypothetical did exist, they would be employing each other, so the jobs would be coming from within.
 
Thunder said:
many companies in NY used to have a "no-Jew" policy.
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many is way way different thing then all.

do you think that is just, right, and fair?
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I think it is stupid.

yet as a whole, they did rather well for themselves in the states long before we
 
ARealConservative said:
many is way way different thing then all.



I think it is stupid.

yet as a whole, they did rather well for themselves in the states long before we
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"All men are created equal, and are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights, be them life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness".

Clearly, the right to find a home, a job, and make a purchase should not be limited based on someone race, religion, gender, etc etc. Such would violate the promise of America.

I am saddened when I hear Libertarianism defend the right to discriminate against people based on something they have no choice over, rather then defending those who are suffering the discrimination.
 
Thunder said:
I am saddened when I hear Libertarianism defend the right to discriminate against people based on something they have no choice over, rather then defending those who are suffering the discrimination.
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I am just as opposed to discrimination but I don't think empowering the state is a good long term remedy to ending these forms of discrimination.
 
lovetosing4678 said:
So I just watched this movie. It is on Netflix for streaming if anyone is curious. It didn't show me anything new though. I think everything presented in that documentary, everyone has already seen / heard of. Or at least things similar to it. The little cartoon about facts about gay people, I am sure people have heard before. The rest is just stories of people who have a gay family member. Not to say this movie didn't make me close to tears at points, I just don't think I would spend another hour and a half of my life to rewatch it or suggest anyone watch it, if they have heard ANYTHING about the gay rights movement. It also does not really address people quoting scripture other than saying, "I read it differently". Don't be a literalist.

That being said, I am in support of gay marriage and am thrilled to hear the NY passed this bill.
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Really? You think your view is the world view? And it's not as simple as "people with gay kids." It's strongly religious, spiritual people with gay kids.
 
Councilman said:
What is next, a new twist on puppy love? Oh wait there was the guy in Washington State who was caught doing a horse little more than a year ago.

Is that coming to a court near you?

We do have NABLA out there wanting to have sex with kids.

The Governor said he'll sign it now so that's a done deal.
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Jesus was a homosexual. He hung around with 12 other guys, had nothing but "love" for them, never married, and even let a bunch of stinky priests nail him in his youth.
 
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