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Thread: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    Misinformed. Taxes actually went up during Reagan. He cut loopholes and the marginal rate; however, the net result was an increase in taxes that was also more equitable.
    I think what would shock most Conservatives is the fact that Reagan actually used a varied form of Keynesian economics to implement his budget plan about the time he did raise taxes. Most Conservatives will deny it, but it's true.

    (Also see this article, "Ronald Reagan's Accidental Keynesian Stimulus: Echoes")

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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Call it what you want, but the end result is people/businesses will be paying more taxes. I can't afford to pay more taxes right now.
    Who can except those who have continued to profit during this recession? This is why I've said time and again, tax those who can afford to pay alittle bit more - the wealthiest among us. I'm not saying increase their taxes to some absurd rate; a 2-5% marginal tax rate increase won't hurt the wealthy one bit. Nonetheless, in the case of eliminating tax subsidies for profitable business entities, i.e., big oil, if you're going to claim that ethanol companies have been profitable and, thus, no longer need a federal tax subsidy, big oil companies should be held to the exact same standard because as we all know they've made huge profits for years and in some cases don't pay ANY federal income taxes whatsoever.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 06-24-11 at 07:20 PM.

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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Who can except those who have continued to profit during this recession? This is why I've said time and again, tax those who can afford to pay alittle bit more - the wealthiest among us. I'm not saying increase their taxes to some absurd rate; a 2-5% marginal tax rate increase won't hurt the wealthy one bit. Nonetheless, in the case of eliminating tax subsidies for profitable business entities, i.e., big oil, if you're going to claim that ethanol companies have been profitable and, thus, no longer need a federal tax subsidy...
    I've profited during this depression, even since Obama banned drilling. However, my profit is half what it was a few years ago. So now, you say that instead of paying 15% on 40 grand, I have to pay 17-20%?

    Do the math, dude. You'll see that what you're suggesting will put many-a-small business owner below the poverty level.

    Common sense really needs to take hold among the ranks of the Left, at some point.

    big oil companies should be held to the exact same standard because as we all know they've made huge profits for years and in some cases don't pay ANY federal income taxes whatsoever.
    We know? You can prove that?

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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I've profited during this depression, even since Obama banned drilling. However, my profit is half what it was a few years ago. So now, you say that instead of paying 15% on 40 grand, I have to pay 17-20%?

    Do the math, dude. You'll see that what you're suggesting will put many-a-small business owner below the poverty level.

    Common sense really needs to take hold among the ranks of the Left, at some point.
    Your business only makes 40k/year? Is that how much you take home and how much is left after operating cost? Then your business is not profitable.
    Last edited by xpiher; 06-24-11 at 07:39 PM.
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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by Gargantuan View Post
    It's not taxing industry. It's getting rid of subsidies and loopholes, which are something that a real fiscal conservative would be opposed to - because in reality that's picking winners and losers. Subsidize one corporation but let the other out in the dust - leave them all to do what they need to do without government aid, and without getting gigantic tax receipts from Uncle Sam and not paying anything.
    I bet it would be interesting to look at the make-up of the Congresses and the Executive that passed and signed bills that began each subsidy and loophole. My guess is that both parties were involved in many and the Dems in the others.

    As for a conservative opposed to ending subsidies and loopholes, you are wrong. I have stated here previously that I would end all subsidies and loopholes to all companies. Of course, I would end all taxation of companies too, but that's a different story.

    Since the 1930s, the Dems have grown entitlement programs to where they make up a large percentage of the budget. Republicans have opposed Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and most of the other entitlement programs. It is the Dems who have spent and spent. Yes, Republicans have too, but in comparison to he Dems, they are mere pikers. Due to the condition of the economy, it is not time to raise taxes. It is time to cut the spending.

    Once the budget is under better control and when the economy is growing at a consistent and decent rate, then let's look at the tax structure and make significant changes to it and make it simple.

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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    Your business only makes 40k/year? Is that how much you take home and how much is left after operating cost? Then your business is not profitable.
    Not profitable? How do you figger that? I made a 20% profit in 2010; that's above the national average. So, where are you coming from, exactly?

    And, no, my business doesn't make 40 g's a year. Wait, let me rephrase that: my business didn't only make 40 g's a year...before the Libbos took over the government and ****ed everything up.
    Last edited by apdst; 06-24-11 at 07:57 PM.

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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Not profitable? How do you figger that? I made a 20% profit in 2010; that's above the national average. So, where are you coming from, exactly?

    And, no, my business doesn't make 40 g's a year. Wait, let me rephrase that: my business didn't only make 40 g's a year...before the Libbos took over the government and ****ed everything up.
    Re-read what I asked. If you take all your profit as income, and your income is only 40k a year, which your statements lead me to believe, than your business is not profitable because you aren't including your income in the equation. If I misread your statements, then I'm wrong. Please clarify how much your business makes and how much you make.
    Hayek - too liberal for republicans

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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigfoot 88 View Post
    Tax cuts pay for themselves
    No, they don't. That has been fantasy from day one, and continues to be fantasy. Even if it were the case, it would have diminishing returns... once tax rates get low, going lower has a lesser effect than lowering tax rates when they were high. Case in point, lowering interest rates, which once could be used to stimulate the economy, but now have no effect on economic growth.

    Income tax rates under GW Bush led to less revenue from income taxes. This was masked by the fact that revenue derived from payroll taxes increased. The government has been subtly shifting the tax burden from the wealthy to the middle class by increasingly relying on payroll taxes to provide tax revenues.

    It is time for hefty income tax rate increases on the highest of incomes. Tax policies of the previous 30 years have done nothing but bifurcate American into the haves and have nots. Without a vibrant middle class, we do not have a strong economy. Until Washington begins to favor the middle class, we will remain in a world of hurt.

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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by xpiher View Post
    Re-read what I asked. If you take all your profit as income, and your income is only 40k a year, which your statements lead me to believe, than your business is not profitable because you aren't including your income in the equation. If I misread your statements, then I'm wrong. Please clarify how much your business makes and how much you make.
    This year, me and my company made 40 grand in profit, after deductions. And, you want me to pay more?

    yeah! That's going to encourage small business growth.

    BTW, what was your tax bill for 2010?

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    Re: Key republican bolts from debt ceiling talks

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    This year, me and my company made 40 grand in profit, after deductions. And, you want me to pay more?

    yeah! That's going to encourage small business growth.

    BTW, what was your tax bill for 2010?
    Yes. No company deserves a subsidy.

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