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Thread: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

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    Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/19/bu...ness&seid=auto

    This is why the US is in trouble...

    Top pay rose 13.9% in 2010... in a recession.. for the top executives. While they are laying off people left and right and refusing to hire people, and workers are forced to go down in wages.... the top brass gets a much much much much higher than inflation pay rise...

    The amount paid, was the same as the GDP of Tajikistan...

    But the kicker is this one..

    Thirty-two companies paid their top executives more in 2010 than they paid in cash income taxes.
    Talk about a wacked out priorities ....
    PeteEU

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    Re: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    Nancy Pelosi's wealth increased by 62% last year. I guess she's part of the greed problem.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    Income disparity is something new in the US, that's why they're 'in trouble'?

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    Re: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Nancy Pelosi's wealth increased by 62% last year. I guess she's part of the greed problem.
    I don't understand this form of argument, instead of denying that there isn't a problem you deny that someone has no right to point it out because of some generalization and guilt by association, regardless of how small that association is.

    So what point are you trying to make? That while you admit there's a "greed problem" I mean you say it right there and claim someone is part of it, so it must exist in your mind, Nancy Pelosi is part of it therefore he has no right to point it out, thus you win the argument? That doesn't address the issue at all, in fact I think it makes it worse because you seem to not deny there is a problem but think we have to ignore it because someone is a hypocrite via guilt by association.

    You can still be a hypocrite and be right. If you're a liar, and say someone else is lying when they are in fact lying, they are still a damn liar regardless if the person calling them out is a hypocrite. And suggesting that no that person is in fact not a liar is a dangerous denial of reality just for the sake of attempting to take a smug moral superiority by attacking someone with a weak guilt by association argument.

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    Re: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    I don't understand this form of argument, instead of denying that there isn't a problem you deny that someone has no right to point it out because of some generalization and guilt by association, regardless of how small that association is.

    So what point are you trying to make? That while you admit there's a "greed problem" I mean you say it right there and claim someone is part of it, so it must exist in your mind, Nancy Pelosi is part of it therefore he has no right to point it out, thus you win the argument? That doesn't address the issue at all, in fact I think it makes it worse because you seem to not deny there is a problem but think we have to ignore it because someone is a hypocrite via guilt by association.

    You can still be a hypocrite and be right. If you're a liar, and say someone else is lying when they are in fact lying, they are still a damn liar regardless if the person calling them out is a hypocrite. And suggesting that no that person is in fact not a liar is a dangerous denial of reality just for the sake of attempting to take a smug moral superiority by attacking someone with a weak guilt by association argument.
    Because I know Pete.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Because I know Pete.
    That really wasn't better than your first argument for the same reason. Im really not even sure what point you are trying to make now, do you think there's a problem, not think there is a problem? Whats your opinion on said problem, all these questions which should define your argument are all lacking. So since you can't or won't make a coherent arguement I can assume it must be for one of two reasons, either you're stupid and think you are cleverer than you actually are, OR you're just trying to bait people with these kind of short smug responses, which I guess is actually just another form of stupid so really I can only assume its one of one reason, stupidity.

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    Re: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    So how much is it worth to:

    1. Run a company worth billions of dollars.
    2. Run a company that hires thousands of employees.
    3. Run a company with hundreds of locations.
    4. Be the fall guy any time something negative happens with the company.
    5. Be the fall guy when the board of directors wants answers on a poor quarter.
    6. Be the figured head of a mutli-national corporation.
    7. Be the guy begging Congress to provide a bail out, increase/decrease regulations, or approve a merger.
    8. Be the guy responsible for every decision made, even if you don't get to make them yourself.
    9. Be the guy who might not see his family for most of the year.
    10. Be the guy held responsible when one asshole in accounting (out of thousands of assholes in accounting) manipulates the system and loses millions of the company's profits.

    How much is it worth to be a top executive? Do you think we would find honest, capable, willing executives if we took them down to a rate of people equal to your justifiable level? Do you think cutting salaries to your justifiable level would ensure that executives put in time and effort to run companies properly? Do you think we would be able to fill empty executive positions at the rate of pay you'd like to see them earning? Do you think companies would be more successful?
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    Re: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    So how much is it worth to:

    1. Run a company worth billions of dollars.
    2. Run a company that hires thousands of employees.
    3. Run a company with hundreds of locations.
    4. Be the fall guy any time something negative happens with the company.
    5. Be the fall guy when the board of directors wants answers on a poor quarter.
    6. Be the figured head of a mutli-national corporation.
    7. Be the guy begging Congress to provide a bail out, increase/decrease regulations, or approve a merger.
    8. Be the guy responsible for every decision made, even if you don't get to make them yourself.
    9. Be the guy who might not see his family for most of the year.
    10. Be the guy held responsible when one asshole in accounting (out of thousands of assholes in accounting) manipulates the system and loses millions of the company's profits.

    How much is it worth to be a top executive? Do you think we would find honest, capable, willing executives if we took them down to a rate of people equal to your justifiable level? Do you think cutting salaries to your justifiable level would ensure that executives put in time and effort to run companies properly? Do you think we would be able to fill empty executive positions at the rate of pay you'd like to see them earning? Do you think companies would be more successful?
    I think looking at how much CEO salaries have increased in the last decade, and how much better off economically in the last decade, that it's not going to hurt anything to reduce their salary. Companies should cut back on these ridiculous pay increases, now I'm not saying they don't have a right to do whatever they want in their company so long as its legal, nor I'm I suggesting it'll solve our problems, but frankly legal or not its disgusting to see these people who's company's are often driven into the ground and workers suffering, reap in huge amounts of money.

    You talk about capable, yes they should be capable, problem is many times they aren't, so by your own definition they shouldn't be paid that much.

    Executive PayWatch: Trends in CEO Pay

    http://www.usatoday.com/money/compan...-ceo-pay_N.htm
    Last edited by Wiseone; 06-22-11 at 10:41 AM.

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    Re: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    I think looking at how much CEO salaries have increased in the last decade, and how much better off economically in the last decade, that it's not going to hurt anything to reduce their salary. Companies should cut back on these ridiculous pay increases, now I'm not saying they don't have a right to do whatever they want in their company so long as its legal, nor I'm I suggesting it'll solve our problems, but frankly legal or not its disgusting to see these people who's company's are often driven into the ground and workers suffering, reap in huge amounts of money.

    You talk about capable, yes they should be capable, problem is many times they aren't, so by your own definition they shouldn't be paid that much.

    Executive PayWatch: Trends in CEO Pay
    I'm not arguing whether or not they make a lot of money. I'm asking somebody to provide answers the questions posted in my original post. What is a top-level executive worth, and how to we plan to bring in talent at that rate?

    And to be completely fair, the number of businesses that fail due to corruption or poorly-performing executives is a pretty small percentage of the total business make-up of our country.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


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    Re: Paychecks as Big as Tajikistan

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    I'm not arguing whether or not they make a lot of money. I'm asking somebody to provide answers the questions posted in my original post. What is a top-level executive worth, and how to we plan to bring in talent at that rate?

    And to be completely fair, the number of businesses that fail due to corruption or poorly-performing executives is a pretty small percentage of the total business make-up of our country.
    I haven't seen any numbers on percentages but I wouldn't disagree. Really my argument focuses more on simple morals, which tell me that those in that kind of position shouldn't reap in huge rewards, regardless if their "talents" demand that kind of wage when the company and its employees are suffering. I just don't think its right to take that kind of money and stick it in your pocket when it could be used to help the damn company you run and/or own, not to mention the people. I'm not saying what they do is or should be illegal, its just my opinion its morally disgusting.

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