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Thread: House rejects debt ceiling increase

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    House rejects debt ceiling increase

    Washington (CNN) -- In a symbolic vote to send a message to budget negotiators, the House on Tuesday defeated a measure to raise the national debt ceiling without any accompanying deficit or spending reduction provisions.

    The Republican-controlled House voted 318-97 on the legislation that would have raised the federal government's debt limit by approximately $2.4 trillion.

    Under rules for the vote set by the GOP leadership, the measure needed at least two-thirds support to pass, ensuring it had no chance for approval.

    The vote was scheduled by Republican leaders to show that any attempt to divorce an increase in the debt ceiling from spending reduction efforts -- a move initially favored by the Obama White House -- cannot win congressional approval.

    Democrats called the move a dangerous political stunt that could rattle financial markets.

    "We understand the views that are being expressed" by the vote, White House Press Secretary Jay Carney told reporters before the vote. "We share the concerns that drive those views. (But) in the end, the debt ceiling has to be raised."

    President Barack Obama is scheduled to meet with congressional Republicans on Wednesday as part of the administration's ongoing debt-ceiling and related budget negotiations. Vice President Joe Biden has been holding similar talks with a bipartisan congressional delegation in recent weeks.

    The federal government hit its current debt ceiling limit of roughly $14.3 trillion on May 16. Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner has indicated he can keep the country out of default until August 2, but warned of potentially devastating financial consequences after that point.

    Numerous analysts say that a failure to reach an agreement raising the debt limit could lead to skyrocketing interest rates, a plummeting dollar and a higher cost of living for most Americans.
    House rejects debt ceiling increase, 318-97 - CNN.com

    This is going to be exciting!

    I think Republicans are playing with fire.

    Now I'm not an economic expert, I don't really fully comprehend the gravity of not raising the debt ceiling, but if analysts are correct in their assessment, then Republicans could hand the democrats next year on a silver platter.

    Spending does have to be cut, but token spending cuts like the ones we saw before the last budget agreements are merely cutting the tail off the fish, if all you're cutting is discretionary spending, the fish needs to be gutted to the bone, I.E. serious looks at Medicare, medicaid, SS and Defence, none of the spending cuts likely to come out of a deal, if any is made, will mean anything in the long term.

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    Re: House rejects debt ceiling increase

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    House rejects debt ceiling increase, 318-97 - CNN.com

    This is going to be exciting!

    I think Republicans are playing with fire.

    Now I'm not an economic expert, I don't really fully comprehend the gravity of not raising the debt ceiling, but if analysts are correct in their assessment, then Republicans could hand the democrats next year on a silver platter.

    Spending does have to be cut, but token spending cuts like the ones we saw before the last budget agreements are merely cutting the tail off the fish, if all you're cutting is discretionary spending, the fish needs to be gutted to the bone, I.E. serious looks at Medicare, medicaid, SS and Defence, none of the spending cuts likely to come out of a deal, if any is made, will mean anything in the long term.
    yep, everything will have to be on the table, not just what repubs want to pick and choose

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    Re: House rejects debt ceiling increase

    Wow, that's kind of cool. What's the point of having a debt ceiling if you are gonna raise it at will?

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    Re: House rejects debt ceiling increase

    This vote was mainly for symbolism. It was intended to strengthen the bargaining leverage of Republican House members who will be meeting with the President today on the debt ceiling. However, because the outcome was already widely anticipated, the vote won't really have a meaningful impact on who possesses what leverage. Negotiations on the terms of a debt ceiling increase continue.

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    Re: House rejects debt ceiling increase

    Quote Originally Posted by randel View Post
    yep, everything will have to be on the table, not just what repubs both sides want to pick and choose
    Fixed it for you.

    Reforming and making cuts to Medicare/caid and Social Security is just as if not more important than cutting Defense.

    Almost 2/3rds of our Budget go to those three things, focusing the cuts on only 1/3rd of what makes up that 2/3rds chunk is ridiculous. Its no only republicans trying to pick and choose.

    We need substantial reduction across the board, entitlements, defense, subsidies, research, payroll, everything. On that I agree with Jet.

    I also think that if we start seeing this hurt the Republicans expect to see the quote and clips of Obama saying the same thing about the Debt Limit when he was in congress played routinely to highlight the hypocratic notion of him and others acting like this notion by the Republicans is somehow some kind of new hyper partisan rhetoric rather than no different than what the Person whose now saying "raise the debt cieling" argued for when he was the one required to do it.

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    Re: House rejects debt ceiling increase

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Fixed it for you.

    Reforming and making cuts to Medicare/caid and Social Security is just as if not more important than cutting Defense.

    Almost 2/3rds of our Budget go to those three things, focusing the cuts on only 1/3rd of what makes up that 2/3rds chunk is ridiculous. Its no only republicans trying to pick and choose.

    We need substantial reduction across the board, entitlements, defense, subsidies, research, payroll, everything. On that I agree with Jet.

    I also think that if we start seeing this hurt the Republicans expect to see the quote and clips of Obama saying the same thing about the Debt Limit when he was in congress played routinely to highlight the hypocratic notion of him and others acting like this notion by the Republicans is somehow some kind of new hyper partisan rhetoric rather than no different than what the Person whose now saying "raise the debt cieling" argued for when he was the one required to do it.
    Yeah ole Barack voted against raising the debt ceiling didn't he?
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: House rejects debt ceiling increase

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    I think Republicans are playing with fire.
    44% of nancy's and steny's caucus voted with dave camp

    just seven weeks ago hurryup harry demanded this precise raising of the roof thru november, 2012, with no restrictions

    reps and senators simply cannot return to their districts having voted to extend credit to this profligate parliament sans protections

    stay tuned

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    Re: House rejects debt ceiling increase

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    House rejects debt ceiling increase, 318-97 - CNN.com

    This is going to be exciting!

    I think Republicans are playing with fire.

    Now I'm not an economic expert, I don't really fully comprehend the gravity of not raising the debt ceiling, but if analysts are correct in their assessment, then Republicans could hand the democrats next year on a silver platter.

    Spending does have to be cut, but token spending cuts like the ones we saw before the last budget agreements are merely cutting the tail off the fish, if all you're cutting is discretionary spending, the fish needs to be gutted to the bone, I.E. serious looks at Medicare, medicaid, SS and Defence, none of the spending cuts likely to come out of a deal, if any is made, will mean anything in the long term.

    This is a good thing. The more and more the debt ceiling is raised the more we go into debt. Serious cuts should be made.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    House rejects debt ceiling increase, 318-97 - CNN.com

    This is going to be exciting!

    I think Republicans are playing with fire.

    Now I'm not an economic expert, I don't really fully comprehend the gravity of not raising the debt ceiling, but if analysts are correct in their assessment, then Republicans could hand the democrats next year on a silver platter.

    Spending does have to be cut, but token spending cuts like the ones we saw before the last budget agreements are merely cutting the tail off the fish, if all you're cutting is discretionary spending, the fish needs to be gutted to the bone, I.E. serious looks at Medicare, medicaid, SS and Defence, none of the spending cuts likely to come out of a deal, if any is made, will mean anything in the long term.
    I'm not too clear on all the implications of this, but I'm not even fully certain that... Though it seems that's about one of those things that suggests that the government is broke.

    I'm not entirely certain that the government has much true control over the debt ceiling... I wager it's the federal reserve that has the greater influence.

    I think it's a good thing, I mean, at a certain point the status quo is going to have to come to an end... I figure it's better to go through the process on our own terms as opposed to waiting for the system to collapse suddenly.

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    Re: House rejects debt ceiling increase

    I say make an agreement to cut welfare, medicaid, and foodstamps by 20% over the next 5 years. Make this cut mandatory, but also make it contingent upon true reformations of the program.

    Slowly convert all welfare programs over to work-to-play programs that require the recipients to either attend trade classes (at no cost) or volunteer in trade positions where knowledge gained can be used for future employment. Withhold payments when requirements aren't met.

    For medicaid, revise recipient contributions based on means testing. Have a sliding scale of co-pay requirements, with no deductible. Provide incentives (discounted co-pays, bonus pay-outs) for patients who avoid the ER and utilized PCPs instead.

    For medicare, do much of the same. Another poster suggested making BigPharm bid for the opportunity to be the primary perscription provider for specific medications. Do this for both healthcare programs. Provide no incentives for being the winning bidder (i.e. tax cuts or credits).

    Food stamps become more complicated. Cut the amount recipients receive by 10%, work out discounts on fresh, healthy foods (fruits/veggies/healthy meats) and charge taxes on unhealthy choices equal to but not exceeding the local sales tax rate.

    Cut defense a minimum of 20%. Reduce troop sizes in foreign, non-combatant countries. Review and eliminate all wasteful defense contracts (including mercinary forces and equipment manufacturing).

    Sell off unused property, shop for lower-rent properties for necessary buildings.

    Remove redundant, out-dated, or unnecessary departments.

    50% reduction in annual pay raises, or a law mandating that pay raises not exceed the rate of inflation.

    Use low-security, non-violent criminals for labor to maintain government lands and facilities, offer reduced sentencing options or job placement aid for those criminals who qualify and who voluntarily join these labor groups.

    Cut all subsidies for corn, wheat, soybeans, and oil. Cut or reduce all other subsidies, as well.

    Require a super majority vote for all spending on "pork" or "pet projects".

    Require government employees to contribute to pension and healthcare services. Those leaving government work may keep their pensions, but should lose healthcare benefits.

    That's just a start...
    Last edited by tessaesque; 06-01-11 at 11:46 AM.
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