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Thread: US extends controversial Patriot Act

  1. #41
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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    Quote Originally Posted by GPS_Flex View Post
    Let me clarify by pointing out that not all warrants must go through a FISA Court. The act does address courts with jurisdiction over the offence under investigation. In other words, warrants and subpoenas are still required for the actions you described and the act makes clear that they must be obtained through a “court of competent jurisdiction’.
    The government doesn't need a warrant to ****ing eavesdrop on your telephone conversations or emails... all you have to do is use a word or practically make an international call and it's reason enough

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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    Quote Originally Posted by GPS_Flex View Post
    I still have my freedoms so I’m not sure what you are talking about.
    You don't know how free you are until you test the boundaries of your "freedom." Just telling us you are free is naive... do you know the government hasn't listened to your phone calls? Do you know the Patriot Act isn't being grossly abused? Are you actually informed enough to know every time the government has violated your constitutional rights?

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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    Quote Originally Posted by GPS_Flex View Post
    If we use your logic, the Constitution of the United States must go too. Maybe you can commit 10 seconds of real thought to the issue and realize that we can’t throw out every law that gets abused by those in power or we would be left with no laws.

    The Patriot Act has helped stop a lot of attacks here in the US so its positives are obvious. If you want to scare me into thinking it is being abused, you will need to do more than give me the opinions of a couple of career liars who have political reasons for opposition thereto.

    Why don’t you demand that your elected officials follow the letter of the law or get arrested/booted out of office rather than demand that good laws be thrown out due to abuse? Could it be that you support the bastardization of laws when it suits your political objectives?
    The Constitution is never abused... the Constitution is just not followed, violated, or completely ignored in some cases. The Patriot Act doesn't limit government or ensure your liberty. Comparing the Constitution to The Patriot Act is apples to oranges.

    Because we care about the Constitution and want to see it followed, we are critical of the Patriot Act. You seem to be arguing that the Constitution is imperfect but it still shouldn't be thrown out, so the Patriot Act shouldn't be thrown out either...
    Last edited by SheWolf; 06-09-11 at 11:49 PM.

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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I propose we UPHOLD the Constitution and when laws such as the Patriot Act (the name alone gives it away) acts against the rights and liberties of the People that it be struck down in full. I'll take the random chance of terrorists over the guaranteed misuse of power and loss of liberty involved with such government expanding laws as the Patriot Act.
    I am not that scared of terrorist anymore... Bin Laden is dead and people will kick their asses if they try to hijack another plane. We have seen it happen since 9/11, and the middle east is more concerned about fixing their own countries now (protesting their regimes) than anything else.

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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    The misuse of power by the government and unchecked expansion of the government always has effects on our lives. The fact is they are under the impression that they can't be affected by it; when that is not true. We already have plenty of reports of misuse of power on this front, and that most likely means there is a lot more going on that we don't know. In the end, terrorism itself actually has less effect on their lives than the gross abuse of power and expansion of the government against our rights and liberties.

    Terrorists can do nothing to take away our freedom, that threat is possessed by the government.

    "The course of history shows that as a government increases, liberty decreases." - Thomas Jefferson
    I am kind of shocked that people aren't demanding that we know the extent of the Patriot Act and how it affects us... I'd like to know which one of my phone classes and emails they flagged and why. I'd like to know why some of our citizens are put on the terrorist watch list, and do not fly list without explanation or reason and cannot be removed from those lists. I'd like to know what is going on in Gitmo, who is there, and what are those suspects charged with exactly and the extent of the evidence.

    Instead people are just shrugging this **** off like it's no big deal, and doesn't impact them. The fact is, the law could actually impact us far greater than we understand or even know, and the law is on going. It won't go away when our fears of another terrorist attack go away. The government will still have the same amount of power.

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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    The government doesn't need a warrant to ****ing eavesdrop on your telephone conversations or emails... all you have to do is use a word or practically make an international call and it's reason enough
    Care to provide the provision of the Patriot Act which allows for warrantless Eavesdropping of telephone calls and/or emails?

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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    You may but it seems most USA citizens would opt for security... or maybe they just don't care about something that has no apparent effect on their lives.

    .
    Its really only ok until you are affected or realize that you now live in a fascist state instead of a free country.

    In Europe, we have our own very "patriot act", a law for digital surveilance, basically allowing complete surveilance of communications between people of the state. IP address, telephone numbers, owners of these things, how they connect, who they write emails to. The excuse used? Terrorism..

    We have all lost, terrorism is just an excuse the state use to trap everyone that used to live in a free state. Its totalitarian madness, planned at the highest level and it has moved the whole west and other parts of the world away from total freedom into a totalitarin paradise, where most people live as slaves.


    http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/...54:0063:EN:PDF
    Last edited by Maximus Zeebra; 06-10-11 at 01:42 PM.
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    Quote Originally Posted by Time Lord View Post
    Care to provide the provision of the Patriot Act which allows for warrantless Eavesdropping of telephone calls and/or emails?
    Read Title II... I seriously can't believe how naive some people are. Scary. The telephone eavesdropping was one of the most discussed provisions of the law.

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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    I am not thrilled about this because it has been used for things other than fighting terrorists. Like local corruption, and it has some provisions that allow for some people who have nothing to do with terror, to be held with no rights as if they were in GITMO.

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    Re: US extends controversial Patriot Act

    Quote Originally Posted by Councilman View Post
    I am not thrilled about this because it has been used for things other than fighting terrorists. Like local corruption, and it has some provisions that allow for some people who have nothing to do with terror, to be held with no rights as if they were in GITMO.
    you know that terrorism doesnt exist as described right? terrorism is just used as an excuse to take away freedoms. Fear is the most powerful of tools to fool the population into these kind of changes. If terrorism comes from the state or from real terrorists does no longer matter, everyone has already lost, not because of terrorist acts but because of western governments reactions and how our society has changed.

    Its interesting about Tom Sawyer how he could make people enjoy doing what they did not want to do.
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

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