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Thread: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    and what is it you observe which is corrupting within the unions?
    The same thing that corrupts big business. Political quid pro quoism. IN addition whether private or public sector, unions have numerous legislative protections designed to strengthen their positions, and bargaining power, and weaken the corporate bargaining power. Legalized extortion comes to mind.


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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    Also interesting, those in the act of collective bargaining are exempt from public meeting laws
    It is so nice for the judge ignore the law stating that government bodies are exempt from the open meetings law.

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    The same thing that corrupts big business. Political quid pro quoism. IN addition whether private or public sector, unions have numerous legislative protections designed to strengthen their positions, and bargaining power, and weaken the corporate bargaining power. Legalized extortion comes to mind.


    Tim-
    so, it would appear you find the unions no more corrupt than the employers with whom they are to bargain
    can't see the problem with that

    the federal statutes - in my (never humble) opinion - only serve to level the playing field so that labor and management can bargain fairly

    just so you know, and from the union threads it is apparent few understand anything about union activities, the union is required by law to operate by democratic elections. each labor union/local must file periodic reports with the department of labor. there is a significant degree of transparency

    in my own experience - i am a labor official - there is corruption in unions. that is often found when the members neglect to exercise their democratic obligation to oversee the organization which speaks for them. that is not unlike the result when an electorate refuses to exercise its responsibility to vote
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    The difference between your cited case and what is happening in Wisconsin is that the Teamsters Local 727 (from your link) is a private union. Not a public union.
    Doesn't matter. Whether public or private, people still have the Contitutional right to assemble, and also to band together and seek a fair compensation for their resource, which is the sweat from their own brow. Adam Smith did not limit peoples' right to exploit resources to only those who own companies. EVERY person on this earth, industrialist and worker alike, has the right to exploit what they have for financial gain. The splitting of union hairs into public and private has no bearing on the Constitutionality of it, and is nothing more than a strawman, which is easily blown away in the wind of the Constitution of the United States of America.
    Last edited by danarhea; 05-27-11 at 03:39 PM.
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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Doesn't matter. Whether public or private, people still have the Contitutional right to assemble, and also to band together and seek a fair compensation for their resource, which is the sweat from their own brow. Adam Smith did not limit peoples' right to exploit resources to only those who own companies. EVERY person on this earth, industrialist and worker alike, has the right to exploit what they have for financial gain. The splitting of union hairs into public and private has no bearing on the Constitutionality of it, and is nothing more than a strawman, which is easily blown away in the wind of the Constitution of the United States of America.
    Again, no one is denying the peoples right to assemble. No one. Not Walker, not me. What is being challenged is collective bargaining for public unions. There is a big difference between public and private unions when payday comes around. One (private) is payed for by private corporations. The other (public) is payed for by people taxes...whether they are a part of the union or not. The next big difference between the two is simple also. A CEO must work with in thier budget or risk bankruptcy. A politician however can promise monies whether the state government is in debt or not. And by doing so they affect everyone in that state...union or not.
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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by GPS_Flex View Post
    This is the judge who failed to recues herself even though her son is an SEIOU, AFL-CIO political operative.
    Then Thomas should recuse himself in determining the constitutionality of Obamacare should he not?

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Again, no one is denying the peoples right to assemble. No one. Not Walker, not me. What is being challenged is collective bargaining for public unions. There is a big difference between public and private unions when payday comes around. One (private) is payed for by private corporations. The other (public) is payed for by people taxes...whether they are a part of the union or not. The next big difference between the two is simple also. A CEO must work with in thier budget or risk bankruptcy. A politician however can promise monies whether the state government is in debt or not. And by doing so they affect everyone in that state...union or not.
    How is the Chamber of Commerce different? Do businesses not elect the people who oversee government contracts? Why is their right to assemble and lobby government to be protected while not protecting the rights of workers to assemble?

    Where do you stop the line at who gets to assemble?

    Do you think corn producers who lobby government to get ethanol subsidies for their members (at taxpayer expense) should be disallowed from assembling? Should they be disallowed from donating to campaigns? After all, they're doing so for their own self-interest? Why are they better than teachers or others who actually work for government (as opposed to just taking money from government)?

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    Where do you stop the line at who gets to assemble?
    How do you not comprehend that it's not about anyone's 'right to assemble', but about their 'ability to negotiate certain aspects of union contracts? They can assemble whenever, however, with whomever they like... the law simply removes their ability to negotiate certain aspects of their contract.

    It quite simply is NOT rocket science.

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    How do you not comprehend that it's not about anyone's 'right to assemble', but about their 'ability to negotiate certain aspects of union contracts? They can assemble whenever, however, with whomever they like... the law simply removes their ability to negotiate certain aspects of their contract.

    It quite simply is NOT rocket science.
    Which essentially make assembling pointless. Why assemble if you can't negotiate anything? To bake cookies together?

    It would be like opening a bar with no booze and wondering why people don't show up.

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    How do you not comprehend that it's not about anyone's 'right to assemble', but about their 'ability to negotiate certain aspects of union contracts? They can assemble whenever, however, with whomever they like... the law simply removes their ability to negotiate certain aspects of their contract.

    It quite simply is NOT rocket science.
    apparently it is rocket science to those who are unable to grasp that the right of assembly provides for the ability to form an assembledge. a collective of individuals. in this instance a union, complete with the opportunity to negotiate as a collective assembly
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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