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Thread: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    The right to assemble? It's pretty clearly stated in the 1st Amendment.
    What does the right to assemble have to do with forcing people to pay union dues if they don’t want to be in said union?

    "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    It would seem that the constitution is just a god damn piece of paper, to be trotted out when expedient.

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    When was it in your life that you really started to apply yourself? Was it when you were still living with your parents, or was it when you left, and ventured off on your own? Unions are vehicles of stagnation, think of entrophy. Unions bargain based on the lowest common denominator. They barter for mediocrity, and settle on function. The idea of the union is antithetical to individualism, an idea that we are the people, but we are individual people. There is strength in the unionized worker, that is for sure, but that strength comes at a price. That price is production! It's always about production, and performance. Unions avoid bargaining based on production and performance.



    Tim-
    Then the Chamber of Commerce, OPEC, and all other business organizations are anti-individualism. Business shouldn't get together to lobby Congress and state legislatures. Shame on them for assembling to strengthen their voice.

    Obviously, Industry organizations are antithetical to American values. Industry organizations avoid competition and support collusion dragging down the theory of market competition, thus they are a disservice to their customers, employees, and America as a whole.

    Assembling to strengthen one's voice is anti-American...

    Right?

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    The right to assemble? It's pretty clearly stated in the 1st Amendment.
    No one is trying to get rid of that right.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    No one is trying to get rid of that right.
    I was replying to someone who said that to be in a union is "a privilege". I'd say the 1st Amendment pretty much covers the right to be in a union. Is it not the right to assemble?

    For Republicans to eliminate workers rights to assemble is actually the use of government to sway the market. It sways the market and the negotiation of wages away from workers (with the constitutionally protected right to assemble and the right to not be discriminated against for union membership based on federal law) solely to the employer. Many companies try to make it a fire-able offense to find out what your coworkers make. This, too, is an illegal and false hand upon the market. One can judge one's worth without knowing the worth of others.

    If you believe it's okay to bust unions, then I assume you believe it's okay to be fired for party affiliation, yes? After all, your political affiliation is a privilege as well, yes? I don't see a constitutional protection that says Republicans shouldn't be fired.

    These laws are a government intrusion into the marketplace of wage negotiation.

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    I was replying to someone who said that to be in a union is "a privilege". I'd say the 1st Amendment pretty much covers the right to be in a union. Is it not the right to assemble?

    For Republicans to eliminate workers rights to assemble is actually the use of government to sway the market. It sways the market and the negotiation of wages away from workers (with the constitutionally protected right to assemble and the right to not be discriminated against for union membership based on federal law) solely to the employer. Many companies try to make it a fire-able offense to find out what your coworkers make. This, too, is an illegal and false hand upon the market. One can judge one's worth without knowing the worth of others.

    If you believe it's okay to bust unions, then I assume you believe it's okay to be fired for party affiliation, yes? After all, your political affiliation is a privilege as well, yes? I don't see a constitutional protection that says Republicans shouldn't be fired.

    These laws are a government intrusion into the marketplace of wage negotiation.
    The 1st amendment says nothing about the right of a union to force people to pay dues to said union.

    You are a funny guy.

    "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."
    John F. Kennedy
    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    It would seem that the constitution is just a god damn piece of paper, to be trotted out when expedient.

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    I was replying to someone who said that to be in a union is "a privilege". I'd say the 1st Amendment pretty much covers the right to be in a union. Is it not the right to assemble?
    I think that person was refering to collective bargaining rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    If you believe it's okay to bust unions, then I assume you believe it's okay to be fired for party affiliation, yes? After all, your political affiliation is a privilege as well, yes? I don't see a constitutional protection that says Republicans shouldn't be fired.
    I am an independant. IE I don't belong to any particular party. As far as I am concerned political parties are the bane of this countries existance. Be that as it may people have a right to join/form a party. So no I don't support firing because of party affiliation. As such I have no problem with unions forming also. However I do have a problem with public unions negotiating thier pay and what not with the very politicians that they give money to in election campaigns.

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    These laws are a government intrusion into the marketplace of wage negotiation.
    A public union "negotiating" thier wages with the very people they helped put into office is a far bigger problem.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    And that's the crux right there. The idea of unions I can live with, the corrupt system by which they are still allowed to exist (And thrive) is what most people have a problem with.


    Tim-
    “When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.” - P. J. O’Rourke
    “Socialism is great until you run out of someone elses money” Margaret Thatcher

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicup View Post
    And that's the crux right there. The idea of unions I can live with, the corrupt system by which they are still allowed to exist (And thrive) is what most people have a problem with.


    Tim-
    and what is it you observe which is corrupting within the unions?
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    I was replying to someone who said that to be in a union is "a privilege". I'd say the 1st Amendment pretty much covers the right to be in a union. Is it not the right to assemble?

    For Republicans to eliminate workers rights to assemble is actually the use of government to sway the market. It sways the market and the negotiation of wages away from workers (with the constitutionally protected right to assemble and the right to not be discriminated against for union membership based on federal law) solely to the employer. Many companies try to make it a fire-able offense to find out what your coworkers make. This, too, is an illegal and false hand upon the market. One can judge one's worth without knowing the worth of others.

    If you believe it's okay to bust unions, then I assume you believe it's okay to be fired for party affiliation, yes? After all, your political affiliation is a privilege as well, yes? I don't see a constitutional protection that says Republicans shouldn't be fired.

    These laws are a government intrusion into the marketplace of wage negotiation.
    So, the only wasy workers can 'assemble', is to be in a union? I wasn't aware of that.

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    Re: Judge voids controversial Wisconsin union law

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    So, the only wasy workers can 'assemble', is to be in a union? I wasn't aware of that.
    not the only way, but it does deprive the right fo assembly regarding their desire to assemble as a union
    or are you of the opinion that the government gets to choose/limit your right of assembly
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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