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Fox News viewers overwhelmingly misinformed about health care reform proposals.

akyron said:
No one likes bad news I guess. its common.

We are going to tax you and tax you and tax you ad infinitum ...One can only take so much before they say something about it.
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95% of us average taxpayer will pay less than we did under Bush & we aren't paying the $4.00/gallon +...TAX that we paid when the Repubs ran things. Youi never hear these truths from Fox though...Do you?
 
Devil505 said:
95% of us average taxpayer will pay less than we did under Bush & we aren't paying the $4.00/gallon +...TAX that we paid when the Repubs ran things.
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Yeah, because no one is working...:rofl
 
Devil505 said:
95% of us average taxpayer will pay less than we did under Bush & we aren't paying the $4.00/gallon +...TAX that we paid when the Repubs ran things. Youi never hear these truths from Fox though...Do you?
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Yes, Obama and Congress just quadrupled the deficeit in 6 months, and the rich are going to be able to take the whole burden. Keep dreaming
 
apdst said:
Yeah, because no one is working...:rofl
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While you'll never hear it on Fox News, the economy is improving & we are no longer on the threshold of another great depression.
Obama deserves much credit in that he put allot of taxpayer money back into this country, rather than into the hands of Iraqi swindlers, Haliburton, KBR & Blackwater & Exxon-Mobil. That's what he promised in the election campaign, that's why we elected him & that's what he's doing.
If you get all your news from Fox, you will be hearing just the GOP's voice....Not reality.
 
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Devil505 said:
No economist (on either side) said we could fix our economic problems "On The Cheap" or overnight.
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While government spending's stimulative effect on the economy is debatable, the notion that the new costs of Obama's spending can be completely absorbed by the rich, as you and he claim, is absurd.
 
Devil505 said:
95% of us average taxpayer will pay less than we did under Bush ?
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You obviously have not read any of the recent bills in congress.

Oh and Obama is Bush. Just with an X multiplier.

[ame="http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7886780711843120756"]The Obama Deception[/ame]


Patients First: What Is In The Bill?


I am for reform. This is not reform. This is a government takover just like the auto industry and the banks.

If the government was interested in reform they would take the best healthcare optioned most successful insurance company and analyze it, make improvements on, then duplicate and make it available in the medicaid and medicare system. Just remove the 65 age limit and done. Tax welfare for the payments as necessary. Thats milk thats already spilled.
 
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DrunkenAsparagus said:
While government spending's stimulative effect on the economy is debatable, the notion that the new costs of Obama's spending can be completely absorbed by the rich, as you and he claim, is absurd.
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Neither of us have claimed any such thing. That may be how Fox News reported it, but it is not true.

Here's what I recommend:

Watch Fox News to get the GOP spin

Watch MSNBC to get the Democrat's spin

split the difference & you are near the truth & then.....

Turn on CSPAN & make up your own mind.
 
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Devil505 said:
Neither of us have claimed any such thing. That may be how Fox News reported it, but it is not true.
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You're sh*tting me

Devil505 said:
95% of us average taxpayer will pay less than we did under Bush & we aren't paying the $4.00/gallon +...TAX that we paid when the Repubs ran things. Youi never hear these truths from Fox though...Do you?
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You said:

DrunkenAsparagus said:
While government spending's stimulative effect on the economy is debatable, the notion that the new costs of Obama's spending can be completely absorbed by the rich, as you and he claim, is absurd.
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To which I said:
"95% of us average taxpayer will pay less than we did under Bush & we aren't paying the $4.00/gallon +...TAX that we paid when the Repubs ran things. Youi never hear these truths from Fox though...Do you?"

To which you responded:


DrunkenAsparagus said:
You're sh*tting me
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With my above quote?? Show me where I (or Obama) claimed that all his spending would ...."be completely absorbed by the rich"......??????

(Sorry....Just sounds like Fox News SPIN to me)
 
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First of all, if you are using an NBC article as your source for an article regarding FOX news I hope you realize it will be biased. Fox and NBC are ALWAYS at each other's necks.

But lets look at this "misinformation":

On the issue of illegal immigrants being covered, check these sources:
Will Health Insurance Reform Cover Undocumented Immigrants?
Here are the facts:

* Democrats intentionally left gaping loopholes in the healthcare bill that will allow illegal immigrants to receive taxpayer-funded benefits.
* The bill contains no verification mechanism to ensure that illegal immigrants do not apply for benefits. In fact, Democrats rejected an amendment to close this loophole.
* The bill leaves open the possibility that if one citizen family member is eligible for affordability credits, then the whole family including illegal immigrant family members, are also eligible for the credits.

Ranking Member Lamar Smith said, “The proposed healthcare scheme could force the American people to pay for the health care of illegal immigrants. This is another reason to oppose it.

Hmm...stupid FOX viewers, how DARE they question Obama....:doh

On to Abortion:
Does House Healthcare Bill Fund Abortion? Depends on Whom You Ask - God & Country (usnews.com)
The question revolves largely around an amendment to the House healthcare bill that was adopted by the Energy and Commerce Committee last Thursday. The amendment prohibits federal funds from explicitly subsidizing abortion in the private healthcare plans to be offered through the health insurance exchange (read it here). But it doesn't prevent "the public health insurance option from providing for or prohibiting coverage" of abortion.
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Oh, those STUPID Fox viewers! What idiots!

Public option can lead to full government control:
You do realize that this is possible...dont you? The bill doesn't have to specifically say that a single-payer system will be emplemented. It can still happen via competition. And private insurance companies can't print their own money or offer free care now, can they?
Oh, and I guess Obama changed his mind within a year. He said that he was a proponent of a single payer system. He then said "We may not get there immediately". Hmm...
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpAyan1fXCE"]YouTube - Obama on single payer health insurance[/ame]
Again, those FOX viewers really are incredibly stupid for thinking these things!

Rationing care:
Senate Committee Blocks Anti-Rationing Amendments The Foundry
Amendments designed to prevent this were rejected. Nearly every country with government run healthcare has problems with rationing care, notably GB and Canada.
How can Fox viewers be so STUPID?:roll:



There are so many "stupid" people out there, don't you agree?




Well I guess I'm one of them.
 
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Devil505 said:
You said: With my above quote?? Show me where I (or Obama) claimed that all his spending would ...."be completely absorbed by the rich"......??????

(Sorry....Just sounds like Fox News SPIN to me)
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I said NEW spending. You claimed that 95% of people were getting a tax cut. This means the rich would have to pay for the spending increases or Obama and you are wrong about 95% of the taxpayers getting a tax cut.
 
DrunkenAsparagus said:
I said NEW spending. You claimed that 95% of people were getting a tax cut. This means the rich would have to pay for the spending increases or Obama and you are wrong about 95% of the taxpayers getting a tax cut.
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Not true at all. If you listen to Obama's plan, much wasteful spending will be done away with & much of the new spending will provide new/renewed jobs which will (intern) create more tax money for the government at a lower tax rate for people earning less than $250,000.00/year. (my 40 yr old daughter will be working as a public school teacher again this year due to government money made available to pay her salary....& paying taxes that she wouldn't be paying if her job had been cut.)
Show me where Obama or I say that the rich will pay for everything??

Again....I say you're just "Spinning."
 
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Devil505 said:
Not true at all. If you listen to Obama's plan, much wasteful spending will be done away with & much of the new spending will provide new/renewed jobs which will (intern) create more tax money for the government at a lower tax rate for people earning less than $250,000.00/year. (my 40 yr old daughter will be working as a public school teacher again this year due to government money made available to pay her salary....& paying taxes that she wouldn't be paying if her job had been cut.)
Show me where Obama or I say that the rich will pay for everything??
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And if you believe that the government can increase its scope to that degree and cut waste, you've been played. Politicians promise a lot of things

http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/102xx/doc10296/TablesforWeb.pdf
 
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Perhaps if the president wasn't so unbelievably bad at explaining things there wouldn't be any confusion.

Or go on Fox News and explain it to the viewers. What a whiner!
 
sazerac said:
Perhaps if the president wasn't so unbelievably bad at explaining things there wouldn't be any confusion.
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Yeah....If only Obama was as articulate, honest & well spoken as GW Bush.:popcorn2:
 
Devil505 said:
Yeah....If only Obama was as articulate, honest & well spoken as GW Bush.:popcorn2:
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It's always has to be about Bush with you all. :roll:

Obama deserves what he's getting for going about all this with no concern for the other side and what it wants.
 
sazerac said:
It's always has to be about Bush with you all. :roll:

Obama deserves what he's getting for going about all this with no concern for the other side and what it wants.
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The other side wants to kill any HC reform & protect their insurance company masters.
We American people elected Obama in large part on his promise to reform HC & we will not allow the few to dictate to the many anymore.
 
Re: Abortion

While it is correct, no wording exists that even mentions abortion in the proposed bill. This is deceiving because, the supreme count has ruled unless specifically forbidden, abortion is permitted.

This bring us to the Hyde Amendment. This bill does forbid federal funding of abortions. However, it does not apply to this new healthcare bill as it only applies to Medicaid.

The way I see it, this bill will clearly allow federal funding of abortion.

Where am I mistaken? This issue looks pretty clear to me.
 
Harshaw said:
OK.

And as of 2007, 61% of Democrats either believed Bush knew about the 9/11 attacks ahead of time (35%) or aren't sure (26%).

Who were they watching?

(EDIT: THE POINT, in case you don't follow: you can find a poll to stroke your ego no matter what the topic.)
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I think they've been stroking ...er, their own "egos".
 
Devil said:
The other side wants to kill any HC reform
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WRONG.
Republicans Offer Health-Care Plan - WSJ.com
There is one Republican healthcare plan. There is also tort reform, which would effect healthcare insurance companies.
Republicans have also proposed amendments that would prevent rationing care (which have been turned down)

Have you honestly not heard of these other proposals? Or are you just ignoring them so you can stick to the "party of no" rhetoric?

While it is correct, no wording exists that even mentions abortion in the proposed bill. This is deceiving because, the supreme count has ruled unless specifically forbidden, abortion is permitted.

This bring us to the Hyde Amendment. This bill does forbid federal funding of abortions. However, it does not apply to this new healthcare bill as it only applies to Medicaid.

The way I see it, this bill will clearly allow federal funding of abortion.

Where am I mistaken? This issue looks pretty clear to me.
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Exactly.
 
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Devil505 said:
All politicians are not the same. Some actually are truthful. (Eisenhower & Truman pop into my mind.....& Churchill of course)
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Firstly, Obama has failed to show me any evidence that he is as honest as these three men. There are honest politicians, but they are few and far between. Secondly, it doesn't matter if Obama wants to cut waste. You can't just will problems away, especially not with big government. He may intend to cut waste, but to paraphrase Milton Friedman, never judge government action by its intentions instead of its results.
 
!

Lakryte said:
WRONG.
Republicans Offer Health-Care Plan - WSJ.com
There is one Republican healthcare plan.
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Have a link to the actual plan itself? (or is it like the GOP budget...an empty binder)
If the GOP really WANTS to reform HC...Why did we hear nothing from them for the last 12 years?
The GOP isn't FOR anything...Just AGAINST anything the Dems offer, regardless of whether it's good for the country or not.

Lakryte said:
Have you honestly not heard of these other proposals? Or are you just ignoring them so you can stick to the "party of no" rhetoric?


Exactly.
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What we all heard was Sen. James DeMint tell his GOP buddies that they can Break Obama over HC reform....that it will be his Waterloo.

How about us American taxpayers??..Does the GOP care anything about us??

Answer is NO!
 
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Devil said:
If the GOP really WANTS to reform HC...Why did we hear nothing from them for the last 12 years?
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Well first off, under Bush medicare was reformed by Bush...but Why does that matter? Whether or not Republicans spoke up about healthcare in the past doesn't negate the fact that they are speaking up now.
Devil said:
The GOP isn't FOR anything...Just AGAINST anything the Dems offer, regardless of whether it's good for the country or not.
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*sigh* Get your facts straight. The GOP is of course against the Democrats on most issues and the Democrats are against the GOP on most issues as well. (hence the two parties) I can now clearly see that you refuse to believe the GOP has offered a plan because it goes against your own partisan rhetoric idea of "party of no". Well guess what, you are WRONG. So deal with it and put yourself back into reality. Your arrogance annoys me.
Devil said:
Have a link to the actual plan itself?
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The plan exists. I hate to break it to you. It is called the "Patients' Choice Act". Here is a link to Paul Ryan talking about it:
Patients' Choice Act
Some articles and interviews talking about the GOP plan are also on the site, you can click the links on the page above and watch the video.
house.gov said:
Health Care Reform: A Debate Worth Having, By Paul Ryan and Devin Nunes
Washington Times
June 8, 2009
UpFront with Mike Gousha: Rep. Ryan Talks About National Health Care
May 31, 2009
“Patients’ Choice Act is a serious proposal that merits serious consideration.”
USA Today Editorial
May 29, 2009
Rep. Ryan On Alternative Healthcare Plan
Fox News' American Newsroom
May 20, 2009
Press Conference with Senators Richard Burr and Tom Coburn, Representatives Paul Ryan and Devin Nunes
May 20, 2009
"The GOP's Health-Care Alternative" By Grace-Marie Turner (Galen Institute) and Joseph R. Antos (AEI)
Wall Street Journal
May 20, 2009
"An Alternative to Obamacare" By Tom Coburn, Richard Burr, Paul Ryan and Devin Nunes
Real Clear Politics
May 20, 2009
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Here is a 15 page official description of the plan:
http://coburn.senate.gov/public/ind...Store_id=d4eab376-d507-4fb9-9f17-8b479a10affc

You want the actual bill? Well I can give you that too. I don't know why you couldn't do the work yourself and find it...oh wait...I forgot...you are entitled to receive the bill from somebody else, right?

Actual bill H.R. 2520:
H.R. 2520: Patients' Choice Act (GovTrack.us)
Click "Full text" to get the bill.

All you have to do to find out that this bill exists is too look it up. Its no harder to figure out this bill exists than to figure out the moon exists. There is so much information about the bill I find it shocking you can't come to grips with the reality that it exists. Not only that, but it has existed since MAY 20TH 2009. So the "party of no" rhetoric is, to put it crudely, BS.

WAKE UP. You can disagree with Republicans, but to say they offer no alternative is flat out ignorant and not true. Watch another news station besides MSNBC. Try fox even.

Now will you admit you were wrong or just ignore this entire half of the post as usual?
Devil said:
How about us American taxpayers??..Does the GOP care anything about us??

Answer is NO!
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You think the DEMOCRATS care about the American taxpayers when they propose a plan that will increase taxes, but the Republicans don't when they propose a plan that will provide tax cuts?

Do you honestly think anyone, Republican or Democrat, in Washington truly and honestly cares about us over him/herself?
 
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