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‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidency

Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

American said:
Conservative couldn't own too many after your diatribe.
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What diatribe, American?
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Gaztopian said:
What diatribe, American?
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About how humanity deserves all these necessities provided to them. That doesn't leave much room at all for conservatism. It's called self sufficiency, rugged individualism, personal responsibility. You don't get to decide for the rest of us what is human and decent and civilized, and how we spend our money. We get to do that, and if we want to provide charity (which many do) then so be it.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

OrphanSlug said:
We cannot be that dismissive, even though the piece from Huffpo is a bit over the top.

Republicans in the 112th to 114th Congresses have tried some 50+ times to repeal Obamacare, the next 115th Congress will be Republican with Trump winning all of whom said they would repeal Obamacare. There is a strong chance that some who depend on the system, no matter how we feel about the system, will lose their coverage.
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Well sure, in the same way many lost their coverage, and the doctors, and their savings accounts when Obamacare was implemented.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

straykatz said:
I don't know why people fail to see that repealing ACA also means losing what good came from it too.

A few worth mentioning:

You can’t be denied coverage for any reason.
You can’t be charged more based on health status or gender.
No annual or lifetime limits on healthcare.
You can’t be denied coverage for pre-existing conditions.
Adult children can stay on their parent’s plan until 26.
Improved women’s health services, including many new free preventive treatments and screenings.
Preventative services at no-out-of pocket costs.
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Who is to say that the new health care plan won't include some of the good that ACA provided?

You realize having the adult children staying on their parents plan till 26 is one reason the ACA is struggling. The exchanges need young healthy people to sign up for health plans. Not enough have.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

jmotivator said:
Well sure, in the same way many lost their coverage, and the doctors, and their savings accounts when Obamacare was implemented.
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I'm not saying otherwise.

At the time ACA hit I was one of the self employed that saw his personal family plan literally not-renewed and replaced with an "ACA Compliant Plan" that increased my costs each year at least 15% more from 2010 to 2015. Plus my wife lost several of her doctors to "network changes" and a few others that went to charging additional premiums to be a preferred client. All that said I still ended up with coverage, just under entirely different terms and costs rendering just about all of Obama's comments a flat out lie.

The point I was making is now that ACA is here, and regardless of the condition of the exchanges and participating plans (or even how we feel about them,) we do have significant numbers who have exchange based plans that would be directly impacted by removing ACA. Moreover, all the other elements of ACA that protect the consumer from lifetime coverage limits, pre-existing conditions, denied coverage, handling kids on our plans to an age, and so many more are also out the window if Republicans repeal ACA and do not put something in its place.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

American said:
About how humanity deserves all these necessities provided to them. That doesn't leave much room at all for conservatism. It's called self sufficiency, rugged individualism, personal responsibility. You don't get to decide for the rest of us what is human and decent and civilized, and how we spend our money. We get to do that, and if we want to provide charity (which many do) then so be it.
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That doesn't leave much conservatism on this particular subject, yes, though I don't understand how that contradicts my conception of centrism. As for the other part of your post, you really think that the decency and humanity of caring for the sick are debatable? Well, American, they're not; it's everyone's prerogative to be lawfully vicious and selfish, so long as they're honest about it.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Gaztopian said:
That doesn't leave much conservatism on this particular subject, yes, though I don't understand how that contradicts my conception of centrism. As for the other part of your post, you really think that the decency and humanity of caring for the sick are debatable? Well, American, they're not; it's everyone's prerogative to be lawfully vicious and selfish, so long as they're honest about it.
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No, the forcing of everyone to follow your solution to the problem is debatable.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Gina said:
Let's just stick with millions losing healthcare. You don't think that's going to happen?
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Nope. Millions might lose subsidies to pay for overpriced, poorly designed "insurance", it's going to change, the way it's set up is not working.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Renae said:
Nope. Millions might lose subsidies to pay for overpriced, poorly designed "insurance", it's going to change, the way it's set up is not working.
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People who lose subsidies, how are they going to afford coverage?

How else will it change?
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Renae said:
Nope. Millions might lose subsidies to pay for overpriced, poorly designed "insurance", it's going to change, the way it's set up is not working.
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If/when the ACA is repealed I hope something better is put in its place, you can't just remove it and hope everything works out.

People with pre-existing conditions need health care more so than those without and without the ACA they don't have coverage.

Many people received health care BECAUSE the ACA was put into place, huge pot holes of mistakes written into the law and all.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

KopeAcetic said:
If/when the ACA is repealed I hope something better is put in its place, you can't just remove it and hope everything works out.

People with pre-existing conditions need health care more so than those without and without the ACA they don't have coverage.

Many people received health care BECAUSE the ACA was put into place, huge pot holes of mistakes written into the law and all.
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Part of the issue with health insurance is when individuals need to buy it, it cost more than when groups purchase.
The Government could require that insurers who win the right to be on the federal contract and sell policies to federal employees,
also sell (at that same rate) some number of unnamed policies. If a person does not get their insurance through their employer,
they can buy one of the unnamed government policies at the rate the employee pays for extra people.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Exquisitor said:
Yes, the Reprobates gutted Obamacare, they defunded it, took out it's support structures and Obama did not come to the People and say, "I need your help," instead, the People bought up the Republican's propaganda of, "failed stimulus," and "Obamacare, it's not what we believe in."
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Good analysis. This has been their MO for a long time. They **** on the democratic sandwich, meant for the poor, and then say, "see, this democrat sandwich is ****ty". Ultimately, they have an agenda of starvation for the poor and are not anti-sandwich for themselves. Unfortunately, the poor only know they're hungry and mistakenly think nobody cares and stay home on election night.

The challenge for our country is to expose the underlying agenda behind our legislation. If we could really know who benefits from the success or failure of a law, we would know better who to vote out of office.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Gina said:
People who lose subsidies, how are they going to afford coverage?

How else will it change?
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They will instead mandate catastrophic coverage only at no cost to those that can't afford it. How do you "force" people to buy this? Set a date to drop the "pre-existing condition" requirement.

There would be no more penalty or risk corridors. Everyone has insurance for minimal taxpayer cost.

FYI, this is what was proposed a few weeks back by healtcare/insurance experts as a fix to ACA.
 
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Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Samhain said:
They will instead mandate catastrophic coverage only at no cost to those that can't afford it. How do you "force" people to buy this? Set a date to drop the "pre-existing condition" requirement.

There would be no more penalty or risk corridors. Everyone has insurance for minimal taxpayer cost.

FYI, this is what was proposed a few weeks back by healtcare/insurance experts as a fix to ACA.
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People who can't afford health insurance don't fare any better with catastrophic coverage because the deductible bankrupts them anyway.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

American said:
About how humanity deserves all these necessities provided to them. That doesn't leave much room at all for conservatism. It's called self sufficiency, rugged individualism, personal responsibility. You don't get to decide for the rest of us what is human and decent and civilized, and how we spend our money. We get to do that, and if we want to provide charity (which many do) then so be it.
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Rugged individualism. I love when people use that term.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Deuce said:
People who can't afford health insurance don't fare any better with catastrophic coverage because the deductible bankrupts them anyway.
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Which is what the existing Bronze plan does: 6k deductable, 12k out of pocket max. That's why they just say **** it and don't buy it. Its not worth it.

If you have true catastrophic coverage, the deductable/out-of-pocket/premium won't be as high as the Bronze. It covers you when the **** hits the fan, which is what you need insurance for in the first place.

Insurance should never, ever be created/leveraged to cover "everything". It literally ceases to be insurance.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Samhain said:
Which is what the existing Bronze plan does: 6k deductable, 12k out of pocket max. That's why they just say **** it and don't buy it. Its not worth it.

If you have true catastrophic coverage, the deductable/out-of-pocket/premium won't be as high as the Bronze. It covers you when the **** hits the fan, which is what you need insurance for in the first place.

Insurance should never, ever be created/leveraged to cover "everything". It literally ceases to be insurance.
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I literally died when reading this post.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

Samhain said:
Which is what the existing Bronze plan does: 6k deductable, 12k out of pocket max. That's why they just say **** it and don't buy it. Its not worth it.

If you have true catastrophic coverage, the deductable/out-of-pocket/premium won't be as high as the Bronze. It covers you when the **** hits the fan, which is what you need insurance for in the first place.

Insurance should never, ever be created/leveraged to cover "everything". It literally ceases to be insurance.
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What is missing is the good preventative care plans that help people avoid the catastrophic results in the first place. A heart condition or mild diabetes with regular attention from a doctor with the required medications can prevent the catastrophic result, which is far more expensive then keeping the condition stable or improving it.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

American said:
I wonder what you are actually a centrist at. You sound just like a liberal that loves to give things to people, and make everyone pay for it. In fact that's what socialism is. You want to pass laws to make everyone pay for things they don't want to, and aren't in the Constitution.
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I sure don't! Let's start by not passing that farm bill. Why give free money to farmers who are mostly large corps like Mcdonalds, and Walmart. Just to keep the price of corn low enough to destabilize the Ag nation of Mexico and keep a steady influx of cheap labor working in our country like indentured servants. Let's end the socialism of Corporate Welfare! Why should we pay for Jim Joe Bobs new Chevy, and fishing boat? End to Socialism!

Let me take a stab at your answer.

Without farmers how do you think we will eat.

My response

Most of the food we eat is grown in a single valley in California, and those farmers operate fine without taking advantage of it. It's only large Corp farms and farmers who grow corn for bio fuel, and other non food reason (90 percent of our corn btw) that really benefit.

Your Response to that.

Whatever, you want all these immigrants coming here, you're a liberal... insult insult insult.

My response

No, I don't, I want them to have a stable economy in their own country and the ability to farm their own farms without having to compete against American farmers who sell their crops cheaper than it costs to produce them. I just think building a wall is a stupid idea is all.

Your response

You don't have the facts, all of you don't have the facts. Only we have the facts. And the fact is... insult insult insult. t

There saved us all some time.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

ThoughtEx. said:
I sure don't! Let's start by not passing that farm bill. Why give free money to farmers who are mostly large corps like Mcdonalds, and Walmart. Just to keep the price of corn low enough to destabilize the Ag nation of Mexico and keep a steady influx of cheap labor working in our country like indentured servants. Let's end the socialism of Corporate Welfare! Why should we pay for Jim Joe Bobs new Chevy, and fishing boat? End to Socialism!

Let me take a stab at your answer.

Without farmers how do you think we will eat.

My response

Most of the food we eat is grown in a single valley in California, and those farmers operate fine without taking advantage of it. It's only large Corp farms and farmers who grow corn for bio fuel, and other non food reason (90 percent of our corn btw) that really benefit.

Your Response to that.

Whatever, you want all these immigrants coming here, you're a liberal... insult insult insult.

My response

No, I don't, I want them to have a stable economy in their own country and the ability to farm their own farms without having to compete against American farmers who sell their crops cheaper than it costs to produce them. I just think building a wall is a stupid idea is all.

Your response

You don't have the facts, all of you don't have the facts. Only we have the facts. And the fact is... insult insult insult. t

There saved us all some time.
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Yeah, no one else grows food except California. :lamo
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

American said:
Yeah, no one else grows food except California. :lamo
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So far your response is on par with what I thought it would be. You should really use google before going out on a limb.

California grows all of our fruits and vegetables. What would we eat without the state?

https://www.cdfa.ca.gov/statistics/

America to lose one-third of its fresh produce when California runs out of water - NaturalNews.com

The Mexican Farmers’ Movement: Exposing the Myths of Free Trade

https://www.oaklandinstitute.org/node/2200

Hmm, predicted how the conversation would go so far. Care to continue?
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

ThoughtEx. said:
So far your response is on par with what I thought it would be. You should really use google before going out on a limb.

California grows all of our fruits and vegetables. What would we eat without the state?

https://www.cdfa.ca.gov/statistics/

America to lose one-third of its fresh produce when California runs out of water - NaturalNews.com

The Mexican Farmers’ Movement: Exposing the Myths of Free Trade

https://www.oaklandinstitute.org/node/2200

Hmm, predicted how the conversation would go so far. Care to continue?
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California is full of knowitall liberals. I'll let them continue to hang themselves, and destroy their state.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

American said:
California is full of knowitall liberals. I'll let them continue to hang themselves, and destroy their state.
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This statement has what to do with the discussion? Oh its the insult insult insult, portion of your response. Threw me for a second, going off topic and all.
 
Re: ‘Millions To Lose Insurance,’ And Other Likely Headlines From The Trump Presidenc

American said:
California is full of knowitall liberals. I'll let them continue to hang themselves, and destroy their state.
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And damn did they pass some stupid statist **** yesterday there. Did you see some of the crap the people voted to pass? The sugar tax and that condom nonsense are beyond stupid and show the true colors of liberals pretty well.
 
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