Taiwan? ROC? or China? Answer - all the above

jfuh · 07-23-07, 03:45 PM

THere have been various distortions here on this site recently regarding just who Taiwan is, and the real status of with too much propaganda for all the wrong reasons. Nothing more than deep pan green bull****.
Here're a few vids to clarify just who Taiwan is and just what the reality is.
[YOUTUBE]kBDsls4Yseo[/YOUTUBE]
[YOUTUBE]iQDs8BZGpvM[/YOUTUBE]
[YOUTUBE]ysOf1gtyeAY[/YOUTUBE]

ludahai · 08-15-07, 04:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfuh

THere have been various distortions here on this site recently regarding just who Taiwan is, and the real status of with too much propaganda for all the wrong reasons. Nothing more than deep pan green bull****.

Only Taiwan. The San Francisco Peace Treaty did not transfer sovereignty to China (PRC or ROC). As I have said before, only a treaty that has been lawfully ratified and executed can be the basis for the transfer of sovereignty FROM ONE STATE TO ANOTHER!

jfuh · 08-16-07, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ludahai

Only Taiwan. The San Francisco Peace Treaty did not transfer sovereignty to China (PRC or ROC). As I have said before, only a treaty that has been lawfully ratified and executed can be the basis for the transfer of sovereignty FROM ONE STATE TO ANOTHER!

You've said a lot of things - unfortunately what you say is not grounded in reality and predominantly bull****.

ludahai · 08-18-07, 04:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfuh

You've said a lot of things - unfortunately what you say is not grounded in reality and predominantly bull****.

Convincing argument. Care to try again?

jfuh · 02-02-08, 02:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ludahai

Only Taiwan. The San Francisco Peace Treaty did not transfer sovereignty to China (PRC or ROC). As I have said before, only a treaty that has been lawfully ratified and executed can be the basis for the transfer of sovereignty FROM ONE STATE TO ANOTHER!

The peace treaty of Taipei transferred sovereignty from Japan to Taiwan.
I hadn't even realized this before but your entire arguments against ROC comes to a deafening crash with this one simple fact -time zones.
The Treaty of Taipei came into effect with the signature from the Japanese delegate just a few hours BEFORE The SF peace treaty came into effect.
April 28, 1952 was when the treaty of SF actually went into effect. April 28, 1952 was when the Treaty of Taipei was signed and also came into effect only hours before the SF treaty came into effect.
Also if to further elaborate article X states:

Quote:

For the purposes of the present Treaty, nationals of the Republic of China shall be deemed to include all the inhabitants and former inhabitants of Taiwan (Formosa) and Penghu (the Pescadores) and their descendants who are of the Chinese nationality in accordance with the laws and regulations which have been or may hereafter be enforced by the Republic of China in Taiwan (Formosa) and Penghu (the Pescadores); and juridical persons of the Republic of China shall be deemed to include all those registered under the laws and regulations which have been or may hereafter be enforced by the Republic of China in Taiwan (Formosa) and Penghu (the Pescadores).

This including the provisions of the SF treaty that went into effect hours later where Japan gives up it's rule over Taiwan then clearly shows that the island of Taiwan is by every intents and purposes the sovereign territory of the ROC.

ludahai · 05-10-08, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfuh

The peace treaty of Taipei transferred sovereignty from Japan to Taiwan.
I hadn't even realized this before but your entire arguments against ROC comes to a deafening crash with this one simple fact -time zones.
The Treaty of Taipei came into effect with the signature from the Japanese delegate just a few hours BEFORE The SF peace treaty came into effect.
April 28, 1952 was when the treaty of SF actually went into effect. April 28, 1952 was when the Treaty of Taipei was signed and also came into effect only hours before the SF treaty came into effect.
Also if to further elaborate article X states:
This including the provisions of the SF treaty that went into effect hours later where Japan gives up it's rule over Taiwan then clearly shows that the island of Taiwan is by every intents and purposes the sovereign territory of the ROC.

Uhh - WRONG. The Treaty of Taipei didn't come into force until August 5, 1952. It was SIGNED on April 28, but treaties don't typically come into force until instruments of ratification are exchanged or at some pre-determined point afterward.

DarkWizard12 · 05-10-08, 08:58 AM

I thought taiwan was taiwan. :/

ludahai · 05-10-08, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkWizard12

I thought taiwan was taiwan. :/

Some SinoSnobs can't get over the fact that Taiwan was never under the sovereignty over a Han Chinese government from China.

jfuh · 05-12-08, 04:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ludahai

Uhh - WRONG. The Treaty of Taipei didn't come into force until August 5, 1952. It was SIGNED on April 28, but treaties don't typically come into force until instruments of ratification are exchanged or at some pre-determined point afterward.

Doesn't matter there Lu, it was signed before the treaty of SF came into effect hence it is a completely legitimate treaty. Because it insinuates that Japan at the time still had the authority over the isles.

jfuh · 05-12-08, 04:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ludahai

Some SinoSnobs can't get over the fact that Taiwan was never under the sovereignty over a Han Chinese government from China.

Oh no? Ming Dynasty anyone?
But WHY must it be a han chinese government? I didn't realize that China is only represented by Han ethnic groups. Well in that case I suppose then that the Qing dynasty must not have been Chinese right?
To which then who was Japan fighting in 1895?
Who were the british selling opium to forcefully?
Who did the british get hong kong from?

That you have to spin this into Manchu not being Chinese is quite telling of the honesty to this matter.