AsIseeIt

So that is Western idealism! Let these video clips speak for themselves.


1. Police brutality at Vermont, 2007>>>




2. Police brutality on May 1st 2007 Immigration Rally in Los Angeles MacArthur Park>>>




3. No Borders Camp Immigration Protest>>>

Infinite Chaos

Could you explain why it would be provocative and add insult to injury for a Chinese to support Tibetan separatism? Whether on Chinese soil or on Western soil?

I was most heartily encouraged to see the very first Chinese citizen protesting against Chinese rule in/of Tibet was actually on Chinese soil. None elsewhere in the world have said anything.

jfuh has already gone some way to answering your point but...


The principles of free speech may be something you need to study further if you think police brutality is either a result of or caused by Free Speech?

Freedom of speech - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

jfuh

That's just riot control has nothing to do with the fright of free speech. The brutality did not go unchecked in the case of the immigration rally in LA - heads rolled.
How far does free speech go? Even moronic Neo Nazi's and Klan members can congregate and protest.
It's a difference of ideology but everyone should have the right to free speech. IN china everyone has been protesting against Carrefour and rightfully so, but the police shut that down and broke up the protests, even though they were peaceful protests.
It's only a matter of time before further democratization leads the rest of China down towards the freedoms that Hong Kong, Taiwan and Macau have already embraced and cherished - there is no turning back.

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AsIseeIt

1. You have changed the words and, therefore the meaning, of my statement. Nowhere in my original statement had I mentioned anything about "Western soil". Below is the original statement in my previous message:

"[In my opinion], it would be provocative and adding insult to injury for somebody, especially a Chinese citizen, [to support Tibetan separatism by protesting with a Tibetan flag which is officially banned because it is a symbol of Tibetan separatism] on Chinese soil."

Whatever others are doing in their own countries is beyond the control of the Chinese. Hence, my answer will focus only on Chinese citizens' protests with the "Free Tibet" flag on Chinese soil.

A Chinese journalist working for Reuter's Greater China region had said that the protests at the Olympic Torch relay was akin to presenting a coffin to somebody at his birthday party.

Extending the analogy, besides getting a coffin as a birthday present from his enemy, the man also received another coffin for his wife on the same day. The second coffin was sent by the man's brother who was fighting for the family property left by the man's father who passed away a few months ago. Aren't the actions of the man's enemy and brother provocative?

Worse, both the coffins were carried into the house by the man's four sons who were eager to inherit their father's share of the family property. Aren't the actions of man's sons akin to adding insult to injury? The man could even die of heart attack when he saw his sons willingly used by others to go against him.

2. In conclusion, here is a real life example. The killing of thousands of Americans in the September 11 attacks prompted less a sense of grief than one of pleasure in the Muslim world. For instance in the following video clip, the Palestinians celebrated with glee on the streets in the wake of the September 11 terror attacks.





An AP news from Honolulu on May 1, 2008, headlined "Hawaiian sovereignty seekers take over palace grounds", reported that "Native Hawaiian sovereignty advocates briefly chained shut the gates of a historic palace, saying they were reclaiming land of the Hawaiian monarchy that was stolen during the overthrow of the kingdom more than 100 years ago".

Please refer to Hawaiian sovereignty seekers take over palace grounds - Boston.com

I was most heartily encouraged to see the very first group of local sovereignty seekers protesting against American rule in/of Hawaii was actually on American-occupied soil. None elsewhere in the world have said anything.

That is not my point of view. My opinion is that no nations, not even the Western democratic countries, can tolerate ALL protests without some forms of police intervention, brutality or arrests at some time or another.

Sergeant Stinger1

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'How Hollywood sterotyped your (???) own people' the native Americans.
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So where are you from, let me guess 'CHINA'?

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jfuh

Actually yes, western nations and a few eastern nations do indeed tolerate such protests because it is protected right to free speech and protest.
When China is stable and ready to truly join the rest of industrialized nations of the international community it is going to need to also protect these ideals as well. It's not suggesting that you must embrace these protests, not even close. But in as much as I dispise of people bitching about what they don't understand as if they do (ie tibet) I tolerate and will also stand up for their right to do so - on the same hand I will also call them out on their lies and ignorance.

Infinite Chaos

I was simply extending the scope of discussion. I originally (on the other thread) asked jfuh if he had any knowledge of any Chinese pro-Tibet protests anywhere in the world. Neither he or I had seen any. As I then went on to say - the absolute homogeneity of non-Tibetan Chinese (usually Han) pro-China demonstrators was and remains deeply suspicious.

You will find Americans protesting against American Policy, you will find British protesting at British policy etc etc - but the almost total lack of any Han Chinese protesting or saying something wrong is being done in Tibet arouses my suspicions. Before jfuh says "there is nothing wrong going on (from the Chinese or Han point of view - that is not my point) in Tibet" - my point is the almost 100% lack of protest. The history of Tibet is disputed between jfuh and myself but I am simply suspicious.

So........ the reason for the thread was not to lose that particular aspect. There is another thread to discuss Tibet / Hawaii or any other Nation / disputed region. This thread was about Chinese protesters anywhere in the world - of which until I saw footage from Hong Kong - there were none.

I found it most telling that the only pro-Tibet Chinese were also pro-democracy protesters and then that they are called "traitors". To me that speaks of a mindset that maybe (in my opinion) a small proportion of Chinese don't display. That maybe there is a historical and cultural mindset that includes jfuh.

He spoke once of the shared shame of British and Japanese imperialism and the effect a lack of ability to control one's own land and affairs the Chinese may have - explaining the reaction to any external views on Tibet. I just wonder if any Chinese would contemplate how the Tibetans may feel? Do their wishes to control their own cultural and sovereign affairs matter to any Chinese apart from those few in Hong Kong?


I refer you back to the answer above.

So your method was to try and paint police brutality to be the ultimate end result of allowing free and democratic rights?

AsIseeIt

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Professor Sergeant Stinger1, salute!! Welcome aboard to this thread! Your question: "How Hollywood sterotyped your (???) own people -- the native Americans?" Not my people of course, Professor Sergeant, but the people of Jake Blues who claims to be a Native American though I suspect he is a Tibetan separatist.

If you still can't find the answer after watching the video clip a few more times, you have to get the answer from Jake Blues.

I am one of the millions of the Chinese Diaspora that ride out of the sunrise to combat against the anti-China bashers. I am of Chinese descent from Malaysia, a Third World country. Humbly, Professor Sergeant, I am a feng shui practitioner.