teacher

You're jerking my chain, ain't ya? Always with the, "yea, you got that, but what about this"? And over it starts again.

It's just big heavy blocks.

I've read the biggest block in the whole big pointy thing in the dessert is 70 tons. Most likely wrong as that info come from a scientist. Be easy to get a close estimate by size and weight per volume, but who cares?

Gimme, I'll move it. Well, I won't, I'll stand around looking good, pointing and telling others what to do.

So you said before you get the moving of the big blocks, more men, rollers, levers and such.

We? Got a mouse in your pocket?

You're just rattling my cage, ain't you? So you get moving them or not? And all you have to do to place them is stop moving them.

Wala.

But that's not why I'm here today. I'm trying to figure how to make a poster size drawing in paint, highly detailed, you can zoom in on spots and see blocks levered, rolling bla bla bla. The whole ball of wax, from quarry to The Mighty Nile, with all the methods shown.

But that's just work. Here's my new hold up. All the levels are different heights. Why? We know they can quarry and finish to any size they liked, but there is so much variation in the block sizes. I have a quarrying technique that explains this, but it's weak. Hopefully by now I've taught you the Egyptians were smart. They did things for a reason. Why so much variation in block size? Seems to me if you are supposed to make a block 2 1/2' tall and you end up with 3' tall, your boss will be making sure that don't happen again. It may be simply poor quallity control, trading quantity and speed for quality, but this is bugging me.

And Traveller? I got plenty of ideas of the function of the pyramid. All based in reality. If you think this is some EMF generator or plasma conduit to the mothership, draw me a schematic. Otherwise light some candles, kill some chickens and understand I haven't seen ONE solid theory that says this thing is other than a pile of blocks.

Traveller

The reason why the levels of limestone blocks in the pyramid are different heights is related to function. This is why the 'how' and the 'why' can't be separated really.
Get off this 'pile of stones' bull**** teach, its making you stupid. I thought you just told us the Egyptians were smart.
The great pyramid is the most studied structure in the world.
The fact that it has become evident that the pyramid was built as an analog of the plant Earth, as were many other pyramids in different parts of the world should be a clue.

Traveller

teach, your theory of just adding more manpower, rollers, etc. as the blocks get bigger runs out of reality when the blocks weigh in at 800 - 1000 tons - you run out of room, especially if the height of the block increases in relation with the size of the block( among other problems).
I know that none of the blocks in the great pyramid weight 1000 tons, but part of what is being talked about here is how heavy objects can be moved.
The heaviest granite blocks of the great pyramid weight in at about 70 tons we're told, which isn't as easy as moving 2-3 ton blocks, regardless of system used - and I havn't heard a word from you yet! - not that it's your responsibly, but hey you're the genius not me.

Traveller

.......... and teacher, for your infro. I don't buy Chris Dunn's theory

Although Dunn uses the fact that the great pyramid is a analog of the plant, and therefore could be viewed as a coupled oscillator with the plant(which is all true), I believe his theory to be unworkable.
There's lots of pyramids in Egypt that are tombs(piles of blocks) - most, if not all of them are fallen-down ruins, and all of them much smaller then any of the Giza pyramids, and all built much later than the Giza pyramids( as well the -red- and- bent- pyramids on down the Nile.
The debate - is the great pyramid a tomb or something else, has not been settled or solved(regardless of what the public is told)- then why do they still call it a mystery? - and why would NASA be interested in a dirty old tomb? Just because some of this is outside conventional thought and our present historical take doesn't mean ****. Infromation is controlled in ways we have no idea!

Traveller

Where have all the morons gone, done to beds to rest their heads
Well, this moron is still awake.
Lets think about this? - If there are pyramids built all over the world in different locations - that are Analogs of the plant - as well as accurate cosmic clocks - even a moron would have to consider the possiblity that the builders knew exactly what they were doing and why.
Considering the fact that within 50 years NASA will be seeding Mars with organic life forms and looking for ways to generate usable energy on that plant, why is it so hard to believe that the same didn't happen here in our misty past. Beings such as ourselves have been around since time began - we're hard-wired for the job - ever wonder why it's more important to get to Mars than to take care of the weak and starving in Africa - you'll figure it out
So long --traveller

teacher

Here's a difference between me and you morons.

You all make a statement, then let it stand unsuported.

I make a statement, then back it up, dare you to find flaw, and kick some teeth in the whole way.

Any mistakes in this thread so far?

And yet it still took me to explain how to build it.

But then I am just that damn smart.


If you say so...

Chuck

Very interesting

You know, I sometimes have to move very heavy objects. I dare say if I had to move a safe, I'd use a different method. I have actually moved large sections of concrete using my method described below. It also works for moving large timbers and logs

By putting two shims near the center of the block, the load becomes the lever, and can be moved much easier, without needing rollers, pinchbars, or levers such as you use. Proper use of counterweights will let you remove the shims when the moving is complete. This method makes gravity a force to work for you, instead of a force that must be overcome. I can raise large loads by simply tipping the load, adding a shim, tipping it the other way, adding two shims, and on and on, as high as you want to go.

I haven't read the entire thread, 51 pages, but I did read the first and last few pages. While trying to research that Dunn guy you mentioned, I googled "forgotten technology" and found this guy. His method is very similar to mine.

The Forgotten Technology

Physics

His site is a little difficult to navigate, so I included the page six link, which explains the lever function pretty well.

Oh, in 1994 I installed the equipment for a Nissan engine plant in Mexico. We used water levers to set the conveyor and lifter elevations. Very accurate. I'm not yet 50, but I think I'll qualify to discuss them. I thought of animal intestines as soon as someone mentioned the need for watertight hose.

__________________
If you had a right to be safe, you wouldn't need the right to defend yourself.

Don't try to change my mind, and I won't try to change yours. Let's debate, and let the winner take the undecided.

teacher

I think I know this guy.

If it's the same guy, we went over this over ayear ago, it's in the thread, Wally? been asking him to show up forever, gonna let this stew a bit.

Sent him a PM.

I know exactly what he is talking about and have used it. Do you? Useful in certain times. Not this time. Too slow, too much work, don't get me started on the friggin counter weights, he knows HIS way, it worrks, he's WAY ahead of the rest of you...


but he's no teacher.


Sent him a PM. We'll see.


I thought of animal intestines as soon as someone mentioned the need for watertight hose


I'll be getting into this. BTW. You didn't happen to, ah,. write it down, time/date stamped anywhere, did you? Like me? See, way I go about bidness, good idea, set it in stone, or HWSOH's CPU anyway. (Yes I have this all backed up)

But then, if he did, great minds think alike, and...ah, lost you morons there, didn't I?


Oh, my bad, reread your post. The guy you refer to is Wally Wallenback, wore him out long time ago. He don't talk to me no more. Busted his bubble and all. I mention him often in this thread. Tried to get him on board, have saved email between him and I (he he) and, oh well...that's for the look who I destroyed phase of "teacher's pyramid crusade and travelling menagerie" tour.

I so have this pegged.





Oh Tashah...



Right foot green. Nah, you can keep the garter on...


Miss me?

Chuck

Nope, you don't know me.

Hmmmm,,,,, date time I thought of using animal intestines?
How about yesterday when I read you musing about needing a watertight hose in the thread? I don't claim to have thought of it first, just pointing out it wasn't a hard thing to think of. It's well known that American Indians used animal inards to carry water. As a person who butchers his own meat, and occassionally makes his own sausage, an intestine is a logical hose.

Since it interested me, I commented on some of the work I've done that's similiar to what you were discussing. I have moved concrete slabs with the only size limitation being the slab must be strong enough to hold it's own weight from the folcrum out. I have "walked" large timbers and logs on stubs of branches left attached to the trunk for just that purpose. I have raised huge pieces of wood to my splitter with the shim method I described.

You used to move safes. I bet you used dollies to wheel them about. That's why you like rollers for your block moving. What rollers accomplish actually is they reduce friction by reducing the area of contact. Even when they crush and splinter, it'll be easier than dragging it with the entire area of one side causing friction. You do the same thing when you use a pinch bar or lever to set a large machine base in place.

I used to set heavy machining equipment. I know of that which I speak.

If you walk them, your area of friction is even smaller, making the moving easier, making the final placement easier. Using a small counter weight to tip the load to remove the feet makes final placement possible while still using the feet. The worst obstacle is that the entire load is placed on a very small area. This is overcome by your building the road to transport them.


I'm sure you'll have some clever witty comeback to post, all but calling me an idiot and/or a liar, and claiming I don't know what I'm talking about.
But, what I do, and how I do it works for me.

BTW, where you from? Out here in the heartland, where men are men and do a man's work, much of what you are "discovering" is common knowledge amoungst the trades.

__________________
If you had a right to be safe, you wouldn't need the right to defend yourself.

Don't try to change my mind, and I won't try to change yours. Let's debate, and let the winner take the undecided.

Chuck

I checked out your "Son of" page.

Several items made me laugh out loud.

Your "Area 51" is what's commonly known as a datum

Using the North Star for a N/S line is more accurate and can be done ANY clear night. Your method can only be done two days a year, and only in the Tropics. What's more, a near true E/W line can be made ANY clear day by simply tracing the path of a shadow from a plumb staff in the ground, from sunrise to sunset. I can show you how if you're interested.

Your "roller stop bypass gizmo" is called an antiback and is used throughout material handling and conveyors. Nothing new there, and frankly, much better ones could be built from copper.

Your true N/S and E/W lines are called the datum lines and are common on blueprints today. In most autoplants they're either 3' or 1 meter both directions from a designated column, depending if it's GM, Ford or Honda.

Why would you want to scribe circles from your datum lines to mark the building edge line? Just measure your distance and make a mark at each end and stretch a line.

Of course, if the thing were designed properly, cutting the last stones first to build the road with makes perfect sense, as does building the inside chambers before building the outside. Doing it the other way would be like painting oneself into a corner. Reminds me of the old guy who told me, "All discoverers do is point to what others do every day and claim it for there own"

Good lesson on the pathagrean theorum. But in real life using 6,8, and 10 is much more common. For large distances like this job, it'd be 60, 80, and 100 for more accuracy, but it's not needed. A straight line is just an angle of 180 degrees, and any angle can be bisected using just a string. And checked just as easily.

Seems to me you're overthinking what is only good common sense. It's really not that difficult. Oh, and walking and shimming are the best way to move and raise the block too. By the time you lever, change rollers, lever, change to a bigger roller, your bigger roller will hit the step riser before the load gets transfered to the smaller rollers on the higher step. That one won't work as drawn. the concept is faulty. Going down it would though.

__________________
If you had a right to be safe, you wouldn't need the right to defend yourself.

Don't try to change my mind, and I won't try to change yours. Let's debate, and let the winner take the undecided.