11/11, 11.00

bub · 11-11-08, 03:08 PM

90 years ago, the WWI ended.

There were many comemorations today in Europe.
This morning, there was a parade in the village with people dressed like WWI and 1830 soldiers. Then the burgmester read the names of the villagers who were KIA, executed or deported by the Germans, and there was one minute of silence.

YouTube - Nov 11th 2006 - Armistice Day / End of WWI - Ypres (Ieper)

20,000,000 people have been killed, 4 Empires have disappeared, Northern France and Flanders have been badly damaged (all the cities along the front line have been totally destroyed), a whole generation was traumatized,

and still today, thousands and thousands of bodies remain from Flanders Fields to the Ardennes

YouTube - WW1 Remains Found Near Ypres

Quote:

Augustin Trébuchon was the last Frenchman to die when he was shot on his way to tell fellow soldiers that hot soup would be served after the ceasefire. He was killed at 10:45 am. The last British soldier to die, George Edwin Ellison of the 5th Royal Irish Lancers, was killed earlier that morning at around 9:30 am while scouting on the outskirts of Mons, Belgium. The final Canadian solder to die, Private George Lawrence Price, was killed just two minutes before the armistice to the north of Mons, in street fighting with retreating German soldiers. And finally, American Henry Gunther is generally recognized as the last soldier killed in action in WWI. He was killed 60 seconds before the armistice came into force while charging astonished German troops who were aware the Armistice was nearly upon them

Armistice with Germany (Rethondes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
Armistice Day - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Aftermath of World War I - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Iron harvest - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

gunner · 11-11-08, 04:02 PM

We must never forget those who gave the ultimate sacrifice.

A nice post Bub

Paul.

ADK_Forever · 11-11-08, 04:15 PM

90 years. Wow. It seems like centuries. You would think we would have learned more from that huge loss of human life. I believe we lost over 400,000 Americans. I remember eavesdropping on my grandfather, a WWII hero, speaking to my father, A Korean Conflict hero, speaking to my uncle as he was getting ready to go off to Vietnam about the very same issue. Will we ever learn?

I tip my hat to all those who fought for us.

bub · 11-11-08, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunner

We must never forget those who gave the ultimate sacrifice.
.

I've watched several documentaries about WWI today on TV. I don't understand how such a butchery could happen: most of them must have known that they were going to die!

For example, there are hundreds of thousands of graves around Ypres. Basically, they're grouped into units (example: "5th Grenadier Regiment", followed by the names of all the soldiers that were in this regiment, from the officiers to the drummers)

Another example: did you know that during the first days of the war (august 1914), a French army stormed into the Belgian Ardennes, attempting to stop the Germans. 150,000 French soldiers have been killed there in 10 days, which is incredible when you compare it to the 200,000 US Soldiers who have been killed on the Western Front during the whole WWII.

Others examples are the battles of Verdun (250,000 killed for a hill), of the Somme (over one million killed) or Ypres (over one million of soldiers killed for a small town).

I wonder why there weren't more mutinies.

Fortunately, there is now a lasting peace in Europe, thanks to the European Union.

Today, we played not only the Brabançonne, but also the European Anthem.
YouTube - Beethoven 9th - Ode to Joy

Infinite Chaos · 11-11-08, 06:14 PM

I shed a tear watching Henry Allingham try to stand up and lay his wreath at the Cenotaph. 112 years old and still proud but determined to remember his colleagues as best he could.

My girlfriend and I watched the sequence available here at the BBC in absolute silence and we both had the same thoughts watching the veterans at the remembrance ceremony.

dirtpoorchris · 11-12-08, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bub

I've watched several documentaries about WWI today on TV. I don't understand how such a butchery could happen: most of them must have known that they were going to die!

For example, there are hundreds of thousands of graves around Ypres. Basically, they're grouped into units (example: "5th Grenadier Regiment", followed by the names of all the soldiers that were in this regiment, from the officiers to the drummers)

Another example: did you know that during the first days of the war (august 1914), a French army stormed into the Belgian Ardennes, attempting to stop the Germans. 150,000 French soldiers have been killed there in 10 days, which is incredible when you compare it to the 200,000 US Soldiers who have been killed on the Western Front during the whole WWII.

Others examples are the battles of Verdun (250,000 killed for a hill), of the Somme (over one million killed) or Ypres (over one million of soldiers killed for a small town).

I wonder why there weren't more mutinies.

Fortunately, there is now a lasting peace in Europe, thanks to the European Union.

Today, we played not only the Brabançonne, but also the European Anthem.
YouTube - Beethoven 9th - Ode to Joy

The more people become informed. The less they choose death. Leaders grip on people is less constricting of their thoughts and the truth.

I'm glad their is much less death by slaughter now days. Doesn't make for good humans.

UtahBill · 11-12-08, 09:45 AM

On a side note, some Allied generals knew the armistice had been signed, but gave orders to continue the fight as it was not 11:00 AM yet. Some local commanders refused those orders, as the germans were in retreat in those areas, or trying to retreat. They would not see their men killed for no reason. The other commanders agreed with Pershing, and a few others, that the germans had not suffered enough based on terms of the armistice, and sent thousands of our troops to their deaths. Congress reproached Pershing about it a year later, but nothing came of it.
It was a black mark in history. Too bad it isn't in all our history books so our troops know when to disobey their commanders...
I know, you can't fight a battle that way, but you can't win either....
Too many of our leaders see the front line troops as just pawns on a chess board...

::November 11th 1918::

World War I: Wasted Lives on Armistice Day » HistoryNet

bub · 11-12-08, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UtahBill

On a side note, some Allied generals knew the armistice had been signed, but gave orders to continue the fight as it was not 11:00 AM yet. Some local commanders refused those orders, as the germans were in retreat in those areas, or trying to retreat. They would not see their men killed for no reason. The other commanders agreed with Pershing, and a few others, that the germans had not suffered enough based on terms of the armistice, and sent thousands of our troops to their deaths. Congress reproached Pershing about it a year later, but nothing came of it.
It was a black mark in history. Too bad it isn't in all our history books so our troops know when to disobey their commanders...
I know, you can't fight a battle that way, but you can't win either....
Too many of our leaders see the front line troops as just pawns on a chess board...

::November 11th 1918::

World War I: Wasted Lives on Armistice Day » HistoryNet

Quote:

‘How many generals did you lose on that day?’ Bland went on. ‘None,’ Conner replied. ‘How many colonels did you lose on that day?’ Conner: ‘I do not know how many were lost.’ ‘How many lieutenant colonels did you lose on that day?’ Conner: ‘I do not know the details of any of that.’ ‘I am convinced,’ Bland continued, ‘that on November 11 there was not any officer of very high rank taking any chance of losing his own life….’

Conner, visibly seething, retorted, ‘The statement made by you, I think, Mr. Bland, is exceedingly unjust, and, as an officer who was over there, I resent it to the highest possible degree.’

Bland shot back, ‘I resent the fact that these lives were lost and the American people resent the fact that these lives were lost; and we have a right to question the motive, if necessary, of the men who have occasioned this loss of life.’ With that, Conner was dismissed.

What a ****ing ********
They should have executed Pershing (+ generals like Foch and Nivelle) on that day

UtahBill · 11-12-08, 12:15 PM

a similar fiasco, gully ravine at gallipoli...
The 1914-18 War - Gallipoli

11-11-08, 04:02 PM	#2
gunner Educator Join Date: Dec 2007 Last Seen: Today 04:30 PM Location: uk Posts: 1,233 Thanks: 879 Thanked 340 Times in 251 Posts Lean: Centrist Gender:	Re: 11/11, 11.00 We must never forget those who gave the ultimate sacrifice. A nice post Bub Paul.
	__________________ Educate people without religion and you make them but clever devils Duke of Wellington Last edited by gunner; 11-11-08 at 04:16 PM.

11-11-08, 04:15 PM	#3
ADK_Forever Guru Join Date: Sep 2008 Last Seen: Today 04:54 PM Posts: 2,889 Thanks: 749 Thanked 746 Times in 548 Posts Total Awards: 1	Re: 11/11, 11.00 90 years. Wow. It seems like centuries. You would think we would have learned more from that huge loss of human life. I believe we lost over 400,000 Americans. I remember eavesdropping on my grandfather, a WWII hero, speaking to my father, A Korean Conflict hero, speaking to my uncle as he was getting ready to go off to Vietnam about the very same issue. Will we ever learn? I tip my hat to all those who fought for us.
	__________________ Thank You Barack Obama for Restoring Honor To The Presidency. President Obama will rank as one of our greatest presidents!

11-11-08, 06:14 PM	#5
Infinite Chaos Guru Join Date: Oct 2007 Last Seen: 03-11-10 05:17 PM Posts: 2,570 Thanks: 717 Thanked 747 Times in 536 Posts	Re: 11/11, 11.00 I shed a tear watching Henry Allingham try to stand up and lay his wreath at the Cenotaph. 112 years old and still proud but determined to remember his colleagues as best he could. My girlfriend and I watched the sequence available here at the BBC in absolute silence and we both had the same thoughts watching the veterans at the remembrance ceremony.

11-12-08, 09:45 AM	#7
UtahBill Sage Join Date: Sep 2005 Last Seen: Today 04:56 PM Location: Peoria, AZ Posts: 7,680 Thanks: 1,100 Thanked 2,061 Times in 1,387 Posts Lean: Moderate Gender: Total Awards: 1	Re: 11/11, 11.00 On a side note, some Allied generals knew the armistice had been signed, but gave orders to continue the fight as it was not 11:00 AM yet. Some local commanders refused those orders, as the germans were in retreat in those areas, or trying to retreat. They would not see their men killed for no reason. The other commanders agreed with Pershing, and a few others, that the germans had not suffered enough based on terms of the armistice, and sent thousands of our troops to their deaths. Congress reproached Pershing about it a year later, but nothing came of it. It was a black mark in history. Too bad it isn't in all our history books so our troops know when to disobey their commanders... I know, you can't fight a battle that way, but you can't win either.... Too many of our leaders see the front line troops as just pawns on a chess board... ::November 11th 1918:: World War I: Wasted Lives on Armistice Day » HistoryNet
	__________________ Education is expensive, ignorance is costly. Each generation should have more opportunities than the last, but not at the expense of the next.

11-12-08, 12:15 PM	#9
UtahBill Sage Join Date: Sep 2005 Last Seen: Today 04:56 PM Location: Peoria, AZ Posts: 7,680 Thanks: 1,100 Thanked 2,061 Times in 1,387 Posts Lean: Moderate Gender: Total Awards: 1	Re: 11/11, 11.00 a similar fiasco, gully ravine at gallipoli... The 1914-18 War - Gallipoli
	__________________ Education is expensive, ignorance is costly. Each generation should have more opportunities than the last, but not at the expense of the next.

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