John1234

I've not seen anything from McCain in a very long time that was not a distortion or a lie.
But this sounded pretty convincing.
And after lying and being caught so many times, I really would not expect McCain to lie again this morning.

This morning McCain gave a long speech on MSNBC accusing Obama of being connected to the Fanny Freddie failure.

It would not change my vote. There is far too much wrong with McCain and his visions of a global empire.
But if 100% of the things I heard this morning are true, I would be very disappointed with Obama.
It would change my vote from a vote of inspiration and hope to a vote of only self preservation to prevent global war.

So i am posting here to see if anyone can present solid facts that either support or disprove McCain's claims.

Edit: Since the Speech is just now ending, there is probably no link to it yet.

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"We are all Georgians". No Mr. McCain, We are all Americans.

JMak

Thanks for being honest about your intellectual dishonesty.

These are the supporting materials being released by McCain's campaign following the release of the campaign ad hitting Barack about Franklin Raines:

The Obama Campaign Has Solicited Franklin Raines, Who "Stepped Down As Fannie Mae's Chief Executive Under The Shadow Of A $6.3 Billion Accounting Scandal," For "Advice On Mortgage And Housing Policy." "In the four years since he stepped down as Fannie Mae's chief executive under the shadow of a $6.3 billion accounting scandal, Franklin D. Raines has been quietly constructing a new life for himself. He has shaved eight points off his golf handicap, taken a corner office in Steve Case's D.C. conglomeration of finance, entertainment and health-care companies and more recently, taken calls from Barack Obama's presidential campaign seeking his advice on mortgage and housing policy matters." (Anita Huslin, "On The Outside Now, Watching Fannie Falter," The Washington Post, 7/16/08)

The Washington Post: "Two Members Of Mr. Obama's Political Circle, James A. Johnson And Franklin D. Raines, Are Former Chief Executives Of Fannie Mae." (Editorial, "Tough Decision Coming," The Washington Post, 8/28/08)

hat-tip to Byron York at NRO.

What is it precisely that McCain said that you're looking for confirmation on.

JMak

Here's a related discussion thread from another forum here.

SouthernDemocrat

Just another lie on McCain's part:

McCain Charges Obama with Taking Advice from Raines | The Trail | washingtonpost.com

McSame spent 20 years in Washington as a rampant deregulator. He and all the cons that think like him are responsible for the system that fostered the financial crisis we have today. So now, because he can't run on his record or ideas, he has to resort to lying again.

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“A drink a day keeps the shrink away”

- Edward Abbey

JMak

Where's the "lie?"

McCain did not assert that Raines was a "close" advisor. McCain does argue that Obama sought Raines' advice.

Now, lying would be arguing that Raines didn't advise the campaign and that the campaign didn't seek Raines' advice.

Raines is now saying that he didn't advise the campaign when just two months ago he told the Washington Post that he had. See Anita Huslin, "On The Outside Now, Watching Fannie Falter," The Washington Post, 7/16/08.

Oh, and another lie would be your suggestion that McCain is responsible for this economic crisis while ignoring all other factors.

You seem to have a good time claiming credit and laying blame without ever actually presenting an argument or evidence to substantiate your claims.

PeteEU

Not to mention several of his chief advisers have been key lobbyists for Fanne and Freddie to stop the regulation that now is widely accepted to be needed. Of the 179 lobbyists presently running McCain's campaign, around 80 or so of those have been lobbyists for the companies that have been bailed out or gone bankrupt.

On top of that, one of McCain's biggest economics advisor, Phil Graam was the man that was behind much of the deregulation and "new lending methods" that have caused much of the problems we are in today...he even has one of the key bills named after him.

So, at best McCain is trying to take focus away from himself, as he knows that any investigation will taint his campaign and advisor's big time. At worst he is just too stupid not to realize the situation and saw a cheap shot and took it.

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PeteEU

SouthernDemocrat

Does McCain have any evidence at all that Obama sought Raines advice?

The roots of the current crisis is a lack of regulation and oversight. Pure and simple. We have allowed very loose requirements on the lending side, and no oversight at all in terms of credit swaps (which is the real problem here). Who do you think championed all that deregulation that made this possible? Hell if it was not for McCain's economic gurus like Gramm, the unregulated credit swaps that caused this entire mess would have never been possible.

McCain guru linked to subprime crisis - Lisa Lerer - Politico.com

__________________
“A drink a day keeps the shrink away”

- Edward Abbey

JMak

You really want to go donw this road?

You really want to get in a debate about whose advisors are worse? Who has more advisors tied to failing businesses?

Lets just start with this: despite being in office for only threeof the last nine years, Obama was the recipient of the second largest amount of campaign cash from lobbyists connected to banking and finance interests.

Biggest advisor? You calling Gramm fat? Or were trying to convey that Gramm is an important economic advisor? And if so, so what?

I know that the media is focused on attempting to blame this Gramm-led Act as the genesis of this economic crisis, but they ain't fooling anyone. You have to establish as fact that this Act was, in fact, the primary cause before you can simply assert it as such. Not doing so is called stealing an intellectual base.

Kind of like attempting to blame McCain because Gramm advises him, eh. No one on Obama's team has done that or committed any other guilt by association play either, right?

JMak

I gave you the link to an article where Raines indicates that the Obama campaign contacted him for housing and mortgage advice.

Right. Bear Stearns, Lehmann, Lynch, AIG, Freddie/Fannie, they are all victims here. None did anything wrong at all.

OTOH, we do know that McCain was calling for GSE reform in 2004 and 2005 to deal with Fannie/Freddie. But Democrats, having received massive amounts of campaign cash resists any new oversight and regulation.

You mean, too, like Biden and President Clinton among other numerous Democrats who also supported such "deregulation?"

I mean, if you going to blame Gramm, you have to blame all the other who campaigned on and voted for such deregulation.

But you're not. And that demonstrates your intellectual dishonesty and bad faith here.

I see you're a full-blown blind partisan, so I take your comments with a grain of salt. I also recognize, too, that you're not interested in solutions but in assessing blame to those you disagree with.

JMak

Uh-oh...now Obama supporters are crying racism because McCain's team aired an aid mentioning Franklin Raines.

Just goes to show that for some folks this campaign is only about race.