Obama solicits La Raza backing

SgtRock · 07-25-07, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dclxvinoise

Unless you have some proof to back up your assertions, your argument has no legitimacy. End of story.

Just because I have no current proof does not make it false. We have no proof that Osama is alive and living in Waziristan. Does that mean he is not there.

Mexican Reconquista: Leader Says California Will Be First 'Hispanic' State

Reconquista: The Invasion of America

What is Aztlan, Raza, and MEChA

Dr_Patrick · 07-25-07, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SgtRock

Just because I have no current proof does not make it false. We have no proof that Osama is alive and living in Waziristan. Does that mean he is not there.

Mexican Reconquista: Leader Says California Will Be First 'Hispanic' State

Reconquista: The Invasion of America

What is Aztlan, Raza, and MEChA

Your argument lacks credibility and legitimacy when I can show proof to back up my point and you can't. Deal with it.

faminedynasty · 07-25-07, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

The "hispanic crowd" in florida are legal immigrants and citizens, largely hard working talented middle class people from Cuba who escaped Castro. This is UTTERLY distinguishable from the illegal alien masses who have flooded the southwest and elsewhere in the millions and are a vast economic drain.

Whoooooaaaa. Any other south west hispanic people feel ever so slightly offended?

jamesrage · 07-25-07, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by faminedynasty

Whoooooaaaa. Any other south west hispanic people feel ever so slightly offended?

I would think that Americans of Hispanic decent would get offended every time some pro-illegals group masquerades as a Hispanic rights group.I would also think ever legal immigrant in this country would get offended everytime some pro-illegals masquerade as a pro-immigrant group or when pro-illegals call illegal aliens immigrants.

SgtRock · 07-25-07, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dclxvinoise

Your argument lacks credibility and legitimacy when I can show proof to back up my point and you can't. Deal with it.

You say you want proof, Ok here is your proof. Deal with it.

Do you know who Jose Gutierrez is? He is one of the founders of La Raza. He is a Latino racist and a professor at UTA.

The following are his words.

"We have an aging white America. . . . They are dying. . . . They are Shiiting in their pants with fear! I love it!" "We have got to eliminate the gringo, and what I mean by that is if the worst comes to the worst, we have got to kill him."

Jose Angel Gutierrez

Gutierrez wants gringos out of Texas.

Here are excerpts from an interview in 2000:

Q: "If the main goal (of the old Chicano movement) then was to reclaim Aztlan and control all the institutions of civil society, what is the main goal now?"

GUTIERREZ

answer: "I think it is still the same thing. You hear the Hispanic Republicans talk about the same thing. … this idea has even been co-opted by the Republicans. ….The Hispanic Democrats and Mexican-American Democrats and Tejano Democrats, synonymous in Texas, they are doing the same thing….. "

Q: "How are Mexican immigrants of today different from Mexican immigrants of decades ago?"

GUTIERREZ

" They are different in one salient aspect…they are keeping their Mexicanness. ..The Mexicanos that are coming today, even though they are political refugees and migrants returning to their homeland, are keeping their Mexicanness ... They are recreating Mexico here. I think they are doing it because of the sheer numbers. …"

Jose Gutierrez interview in the
Fort Worth Star Telegram, October 18th, 2000
Q: What is irredentism [ethnic nationalism], and what evidence do you see that it is happening?

Gutierrez:" The evidence is their display of their Mexicanness. …These folks now are engaged in active political activity in the U.S. which is unprecedented. They are truly binational citizens. It's not uncommon to see undocumented Mexicans protesting in front of INS in downtown Dallas. ….They have also now gotten dual citizenship. … [The] Chicano generation…only wanted to carve out half of [19th-century Mexico]…. These folks want it all. They want to recreate all of Mexico and join all of Mexico into one. And they are going to do that, even if it's just demographically… They are going to have political sovereignty over the Southwest and many parts of the Midwest.

Snopes.com verifies what Gutierrez says and also verifies reconquista ambitions from many other Mexican leaders. Check it out, deal with it!!!

Urban Legends Reference Pages: Hispanic Leaders Speak Out!

You want more proof? there's tons of it out there. You want vidieo clips of Latino leaders spousing hatred of white people. Claiming they are takeing back Aztlan. I'll post them if you like. Don't ever accuse me of making statements I can't back up. I went to the sight you linked. Like I said "its a smoke screen" ~ Sgt Rock

SgtRock · 07-25-07, 10:50 PM

Professor Predicts 'Hispanic Homeland'
Associated press

Professor Predicts "Hispanic Homeland"

anchor baby video from the La Voz de Aztlan website. At the end of the video a speach from Jose Gutierrez.

Anchor Baby Power

The following site reveals what mexicans and other indiginous people think of white people. They claim the USA as theres. They want all whites to go back to Europe

MEXICA MOVEMENT: Indigenous Liberation for Anahuac

Rick · 07-25-07, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamesrage

I would think that Americans of Hispanic decent would get offended every time some pro-illegals group masquerades as a Hispanic rights group.I would also think ever legal immigrant in this country would get offended everytime some pro-illegals masquerade as a pro-immigrant group or when pro-illegals call illegal aliens immigrants.

There are hispanics (americans) in the minuteman organization.

Trajan Octavian Titus · 07-26-07, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dclxvinoise

Many of your criticisms of La Raza are based on the assertions of Republican Congressman Charlie Norwood, whose claims have already been refuted.

No they have not.

Quote:

I love how you just list them as if they are undeniable facts.

One needs look no further than the Raza charter in order to tell that they are no different than Mecha which they also support"

Quote:

Racist/ Separatist remarks in red

El Plan de Aztlan (El Plan Espiritual de Aztlan)

In the spirit of a new people that is conscious not only of its proud historical heritage but also of the brutal "gringo"invasion of our territories, we, the Chicano inhabitants and civilizers of the northern land of Aztlan from whence came our forefathers, reclaiming the land of their birth and consecrating the determination of our people of the sun, declare that the call of our blood is our power, our responsibility, and our inevitable destiny.

We are free and sovereign to determine those tasks which are justly called for by our house, our land, the sweat of our brows, and by our hearts. Aztlan belongs to those who plant the seeds, water the fields, and gather the crops and not to the foreign Europeans. We do not recognize capricious frontiers on the bronze continent.

Brotherhood unites us, and love for our brothers makes us a people whose time has come and who struggles against the foreigner "gabacho" who exploits our riches and destroys our culture. With our heart in our hands and our hands in the soil, we declare the independence of our mestizo nation. We are a bronze people with a bronze culture. Before the world, before all of North America, before all our brothers in the bronze continent, we are a nation, we are a union of free pueblos, we are Aztlan.

Program

El Plan Espiritual de Aztlan sets the theme that the Chicanos (La Raza de Bronze) must use their nationalism as the key or common denominator for mass mobilization and organization. Once we are committed to the idea and philosophy of El Plan de Aztlan, we can only conclude that social, economic, cultural, and political independence is the only road to total liberation from oppression, exploitation, and racism. Our struggle then must be for the control of our barrios, campos, pueblos, lands, our economy, our culture, and our political life. El Plan commits all levels of Chicano society--the barrio, the campo, the ranchero, the writer, the teacher, the worker, the professional--to La Causa.

Nationalism

Nationalism as the key to organization transcends all religious, political, class, and economic factions or boundaries. Nationalism is the common denominator that all members of La Raza can agree upon.

Organizational Goals

1. UNITY in the thinking of our people concerning the barrios, the pueblo, the campo, the land, the poor, the middle class, the professional--all committed to the liberation of La Raza.

2. ECONOMY: economic control of our lives and our communities can only come about by driving the exploiter out of our communities, our pueblos, and our lands and by controlling and developing our own talents, sweat, and resources. Cultural background and values which ignore materialism and embrace humanism will contribute to the act of cooperative buying and the distribution of resources and production to sustain an economic base for healthy growth and development Lands rightfully ours will be fought for and defended. Land and realty ownership will be acquired by the community for the people's welfare. Economic ties of responsibility must be secured by nationalism and the Chicano defense units.

3. EDUCATION must be relative to our people, i.e., history, culture, bilingual education, contributions, etc. Community control of our schools, our teachers, our administrators, our counselors, and our programs.

4. INSTITUTIONS shall serve our people by providing the service necessary for a full life and their welfare on the basis of restitution, not handouts or beggar's crumbs. Restitution for past economic slavery, political exploitation, ethnic and cultural psychological destruction and denial of civil and human rights. Institutions in our community which do not serve the people have no place in the community. The institutions belong to the people.

5. SELF-DEFENSE of the community must rely on the combined strength of the people. The front line defense will come from the barrios, the campos, the pueblos, and the ranchitos. Their involvement as protectors of their people will be given respect and dignity. They in turn offer their responsibility and their lives for their people. Those who place themselves in the front ranks for their people do so out of love and carnalismo. Those institutions which are fattened by our brothers to provide employment and political pork barrels for the gringo will do so only as acts of liberation and for La Causa. For the very young there will no longer be acts of juvenile delinquency, but revolutionary acts.

6. CULTURAL values of our people strengthen our identity and the moral backbone of the movement. Our culture unites and educates the family of La Raza towards liberation with one heart and one mind. We must insure that our writers, poets, musicians, and artists produce literature and art that is appealing to our people and relates to our revolutionary culture. Our cultural values of life, family, and home will serve as a powerful weapon to defeat the gringo dollar value system and encourage the process of love and brotherhood.

7. POLITICAL LIBERATION can only come through independent action on our part, since the two-party system is the same animal with two heads that feed from the same trough. Where we are a majority, we will control; where we are a minority, we will represent a pressure group; nationally, we will represent one party: La Familia de La Raza!

Action

1. Awareness and distribution of El Plan Espiritual de Aztlan. Presented at every meeting, demonstration, confrontation, courthouse, institution, administration, church, school, tree, building, car, and every place of human existence.

2. September 16, on the birth date of Mexican Independence, a national walk-out by all Chicanos of all colleges and schools to be sustained until the complete revision of the educational system: its policy makers, administration, its curriculum, and its personnel to meet the needs of our community.

3. Self-Defense against the occupying forces of the oppressors at every school, every available man, woman, and child.

4. Community nationalization and organization of all Chicanos: El Plan Espiritual de Aztlan.

5. Economic program to drive the exploiter out of our community and a welding together of our people's combined resources to control their own production through cooperative effort.

6. Creation of an independent local, regional, and national political party. A nation autonomous and free--culturally, socially, economically, and politically--will make its own decisions on the usage of our lands, the taxation of our goods, the utilization of our bodies for war, the determination of justice (reward and punishment), and the profit of our sweat.

El Plan de Aztlan is the plan of liberation!

END

It is quite clear that Raza is a separatist and racist organization which thinks that the south west should be returned to Mexico.

jamesrage · 07-26-07, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

There are hispanics (americans) in the minuteman organization.

Chicago Latino trying to fight illegal immigration: 'There are a lot Chicago Sun-Times - Find Articles

Quote:

Rosanna Pulido is proud of her Mexican heritage. So proud that she has committed herself to championing the rights of Mexicans and other immigrants who, like her own parents, came to this country to live the American dream. Legally, that is.

Pulido actively fights illegal immigration -- she founded the Illinois Minuteman Project, a civilian group that works against illegal immigration, in 2005 -- and believes illegal immigrants dilute opportunities for those who arrive legally.

Dr_Patrick · 07-26-07, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SgtRock

You say you want proof, Ok here is your proof. Deal with it.

Do you know who Jose Gutierrez is? He is one of the founders of La Raza. He is a Latino racist and a professor at UTA.

The following are his words.

"We have an aging white America. . . . They are dying. . . . They are Shiiting in their pants with fear! I love it!" "We have got to eliminate the gringo, and what I mean by that is if the worst comes to the worst, we have got to kill him."

Jose Angel Gutierrez

Gutierrez wants gringos out of Texas.

Here are excerpts from an interview in 2000:

Q: "If the main goal (of the old Chicano movement) then was to reclaim Aztlan and control all the institutions of civil society, what is the main goal now?"

GUTIERREZ

answer: "I think it is still the same thing. You hear the Hispanic Republicans talk about the same thing. … this idea has even been co-opted by the Republicans. ….The Hispanic Democrats and Mexican-American Democrats and Tejano Democrats, synonymous in Texas, they are doing the same thing….. "

Q: "How are Mexican immigrants of today different from Mexican immigrants of decades ago?"

GUTIERREZ

" They are different in one salient aspect…they are keeping their Mexicanness. ..The Mexicanos that are coming today, even though they are political refugees and migrants returning to their homeland, are keeping their Mexicanness ... They are recreating Mexico here. I think they are doing it because of the sheer numbers. …"

Jose Gutierrez interview in the
Fort Worth Star Telegram, October 18th, 2000
Q: What is irredentism [ethnic nationalism], and what evidence do you see that it is happening?

Gutierrez:" The evidence is their display of their Mexicanness. …These folks now are engaged in active political activity in the U.S. which is unprecedented. They are truly binational citizens. It's not uncommon to see undocumented Mexicans protesting in front of INS in downtown Dallas. ….They have also now gotten dual citizenship. … [The] Chicano generation…only wanted to carve out half of [19th-century Mexico]…. These folks want it all. They want to recreate all of Mexico and join all of Mexico into one. And they are going to do that, even if it's just demographically… They are going to have political sovereignty over the Southwest and many parts of the Midwest.

Snopes.com verifies what Gutierrez says and also verifies reconquista ambitions from many other Mexican leaders. Check it out, deal with it!!!

Urban Legends Reference Pages: Hispanic Leaders Speak Out!

You want more proof? there's tons of it out there. You want vidieo clips of Latino leaders spousing hatred of white people. Claiming they are takeing back Aztlan. I'll post them if you like. Don't ever accuse me of making statements I can't back up. I went to the sight you linked. Like I said "its a smoke screen" ~ Sgt Rock

That is not proof that La Raza itself supports the idea of Reconquista. You are trying to tapdance around the issue. The whole point of this thread is to make Obama look like a bad guy because he supports La Raza. You can't just say, "Well, in a roundabout way they support these horrible ideals." You have to provide proof that the actual group itself advocates these things, not just certain members. It's just yet another case of hardcore conservatives making snap judgments about people based on little information. It's oversimplification and it is a tool that is often utilized by the extreme right.

07-25-07, 10:50 PM	#26
SgtRock Kafir on a Mission Join Date: Feb 2007 Last Seen: Today 07:17 PM Location: Texas Posts: 3,845 Thanks: 1,496 Thanked 1,156 Times in 707 Posts Lean: Conservative Total Awards: 1	Re: Obama solicits La Raza backing Professor Predicts 'Hispanic Homeland' Associated press Professor Predicts "Hispanic Homeland" anchor baby video from the La Voz de Aztlan website. At the end of the video a speach from Jose Gutierrez. Anchor Baby Power The following site reveals what mexicans and other indiginous people think of white people. They claim the USA as theres. They want all whites to go back to Europe MEXICA MOVEMENT: Indigenous Liberation for Anahuac
	__________________ All we are saying is Last edited by SgtRock; 07-25-07 at 11:08 PM.

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