Homework Waiver! - Page 4

Kelzie · 02-22-07, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RightatNYU

But at the same time, in many fields, an employer would rather have someone who figures out a logical way to avoid going through a costly process while still achieving the same results over someone who simply does what they're asked to do.

Innovation and a desire to improve are incredibly important characteristics, and doing grunt work doesn't hone those skills.

You have to pay your dues in every job before you get to the point where your employees will listen to any idea you have about how to reform the company. And paying your dues is code for busy work.

Obama08 · 02-22-07, 11:11 PM

Time has also run many articles on the "too much homework" discussion.
Heres an old one from 1999 that I found:
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...990065,00.html
Its sort of long.

Obama08 · 02-22-07, 11:14 PM

In the Time article it gives an explanation to why we get so much homework:

Quote:

After some historical ups and downs, homework in this country is at a high-water mark. In the early decades of the century progressive educators in many school districts banned homework in primary school in an effort to discourage rote learning. The cold war--specifically, the launch of Sputnik in 1957--put an end to that, as lawmakers scrambled to bolster math and science education in the U.S. to counter the threat of Soviet whiz kids. Students frolicked in the late 1960s and '70s, as homework declined to near World War II levels. But fears about U.S. economic competitiveness and the publication of A Nation at Risk, the 1983 government report that focused attention on the failings of American schools, ratcheted up the pressure to get tough again. Other forces have kept the trend heading upward: increasing competition to get into the best colleges and the batteries of statewide standardized tests--starting in grade school in a growing number of states--for which teachers must prepare their pupils.

RightinNYC · 02-23-07, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelzie

You have to pay your dues in every job before you get to the point where your employees will listen to any idea you have about how to reform the company. And paying your dues is code for busy work.

I think it depends on the field though. My friends who are going into some business areas like trading are literally hired to come up with good ways to do things. I've worked on campaigns where if i had a suggestion for how to do something differently, my boss would tell me to go for it, and then if it worked well, id have chances to advance, and if not, id be more likely to be passed over. I'm not at all disagreeing that its important to be able to do mindless/tedious work (I've done plenty of that), I'm just questioning the current amount that kids deal with today in high school. I rarely took the time to really work on homework that I felt was busywork in high school cause I just didn't find it to be that helpful, and in college I've focused on taking seminars that involve a lot more of reading and writing instead of memorization and recitation. Even though I would only spend, say 2 hours doing busy work type homework each week instead of say, 10, I still can deal with doing pointless stuff alright.

WI Crippler · 02-23-07, 11:26 AM

You know, I cannot recall ever taking homework home in High School. Not that I didn't have any to do, but I just didn't do it.

Now, I feel your pain PSG. And I think incentive based training is far more beneficial to a student, as it would prepare them for the world better. I don't know about a homework waiver per sey, but I think having an incentive to get better grades makes for a better student, and you propose as your incentive the one thing every kid hates. Homework.

Case in point. When I was a freshman, I did not care about school one bit. My GPA was a .9. I think I passed choir, and gym class. Anyway, my parents said that if I did not have a B average, I would not get my drivers license. Like magic, my GPA went up to a 3.3 my sophmore year, yet I did not bring homework home, but I made better use of my time at school. Now I had to work a P/T job and pay for part of my insurance, but my parents then said if I could make it to A average (3.7 or higher) then they would pay for my insurance in full. Like magic my grades were all A's and one B my junior year. Those two years of hard work at school made all the difference, and by the time my senior year rolled around I basically had a half a day of school, and alot of study halls where I goofed off because I had good grades, and nothing else to do. I actually helped a couple of girls with their AP US History, even though I was not in AP classes, because I thought they were hot. Even the teacher wanted me to move from regular history into AP, but my scheduling wouldn't work out.
My friend on the other hand who was in the same boat as me as a freshman, did not have incentives from his parents to do any better, and he had to go the GED route.
I was able to do very good on my ACT (similar to SATs) and I never even studied for it.Actually it pissed of this one girl because she studied for it all the time, and I did much better than her, despite being sick the day I took it (I ate a pound of gummi worms the night before, and actually had to get up and throw up in the middle of the math part ) I did good enough to opt out of alot of basic classes in college.
When I was in the military doing my avionics courses, I graduated top of my class and had to tutor others in my class, which I have many letters of appreciation for from the command staff.

I did all those things without loads of homework(I think homework can be beneficial at certain times, but I agree and think that it is being used as a crutch by teachers). I am not even a genius guy. I never considered myself crazy intelligent, but I always thought people made things alot harder than they were. And for some reason, it seemed like girls would stress out about tests more than guys. I don't know why this was, but girls would be so uptight when we had a test coming up, and the guys were usually pretty relaxed about it.

The one thing that may be slightly detremental is that I have carried this trait into my job. Once my foot steps off the premesis, I tend to forget alot of things I have done that day. Its not so much that I can't recall, but I just leave it all at the door. So if someone tells me something to tell my wife, while I am at work I usually forget to tell her. But the advantage is, is that I enjoy my time off without worrying about work.

I think what is driving me to lean on your side on this, is the show I watched the other day, where this kid was 7 years old, and had alot of homework to do that night. 7 years old??? C'mon, the kid should be outside playing, not sitting inside doing homework.

Obama08 · 02-23-07, 11:39 AM

I usually just pop my iPod into its speakers and the homework seems to go pretty quick.

Johnny_Utah · 02-23-07, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WI Crippler
Case in point. When I was a freshman, I did not care about school one bit. My GPA was a .9. I think I passed choir, and gym class. Anyway, my parents said that if I did not have a B average, I would not get my drivers license. Like magic, my GPA went up to a 3.3 my sophmore year, yet I did not bring homework home, but I made better use of my time at school. Now I had to work a P/T job and pay for part of my insurance, but my parents then said if I could make it to A average (3.7 or higher) then they would pay for my insurance in full. Like magic my grades were all A's and one B my junior year. Those two years of hard work at school made all the difference, and by the time my senior year rolled around I basically had a half a day of school, and alot of study halls where I goofed off because I had good grades, and nothing else to do. I actually helped a couple of girls with their AP US History, even though I was not in AP classes, because I thought they were hot. Even the teacher wanted me to move from regular history into AP, but my scheduling wouldn't work out.
My friend on the other hand who was in the same boat as me as a freshman, did not have incentives from his parents to do any better, and he had to go the GED route.
I was able to do very good on my ACT (similar to SATs) and I never even studied for it.Actually it pissed of this one girl because she studied for it all the time, and I did much better than her, despite being sick the day I took it (I ate a pound of gummi worms the night before, and actually had to get up and throw up in the middle of the math part ) I did good enough to opt out of alot of basic classes in college.
When I was in the military doing my avionics courses, I graduated top of my class and had to tutor others in my class, which I have many letters of appreciation for from the command staff.

You just summed it ALL up right there...MOTIVATION!

A student has to want to learn. If they don't want to learn, they won't. IMO, it all starts at home. Tradition. Culture. That is why I spoke so hard in the "Why do societies Hate Families" threads. Society, families, in the USA are broken. It is no the teachers fault that kids do not learn things when the teacher has to deal with three kids talking on cell phones and then taking time to tell them to put them away, or to take them. Then to have one kid refuse. The teacher has to deal with that as some other kids start poking each other or one kids grabs the remote. Then you have multiple distractions. Kids plugged into Ipods. They miss directions over and over and over.

It isn't always that bad, but in many classes it is that bad at least once a week. One day like that is to many already. I bump into long time educators all the time and they talk about the situation getting worse every year...much worse. how is that their fault? It aint their fault no way no how.

This is is Academic/College Prep but mostly in lower level classes. These kids skew hte testing averages. People then hold teachers accountable for a bunch of disrespectful punks who don't give a rats behind about their own education? What a joke!

When I see situations like these, I understand EXACTLY why the Muslims Extremists hate us. They think that we have no morals nor any cultural awareness.

Obama08 · 02-23-07, 12:34 PM

Quote:

This is is Academic/College Prep but mostly in lower level classes. These kids skew hte testing averages. People then hold teachers accountable for a bunch of disrespectful punks who don't give a rats behind about their own education? What a joke!

I strongly disagree with your judgment on teachers.
Sure a lot of them are great, and most of the time the kids are being little punks. But there are just far too many teachers who should NOT be teaching. Take for instance my 9th grade Math teacher. She was a sarcastic, mean, and nasty bitch who probably never got laid. She could not teach math for ****, and HATED kids asking questions. My particular class had a lot of bright and smart kids in it, and whenever we would be unsure of something she would give you some sarcastic reply about how you don’t pay attention EVEN if they were paying attention to her. I can remember asking her about 2 months into school "I'm really not understanding this___(forget what it was)"....she replied with "Well look in your textbook". I said "Well are you ever here at lunch...could I come in then for extra help?" she replied with "Umm no I'm not wasting my lunch I need to eat just like you do"...I then asked her "Well what about after school?" she goes "Nope".
Now before I even had her, my moms friend who happened to be my guidance counselor said that he didn't like her and that you would probably have a hard time with her considering so many other problems have arisen with her. He offered to change my schedule but I hated doing that because some of my friends were in the class so I stuck with it.
The class average ended up being somewhere in the low 50's and it was not the fault of the students.

Johnny_Utah · 02-23-07, 12:43 PM

She sounds like a bitch. But be serious now. Do you think that teaching 50 9th graders math is even a fair assignment for any teacher, much less one that is a logically oriented math person? There are a lot of pressures on teachers wtih tests and performance that are out of there control. You asked some decent questions, but maybe she felt that she had covered this well or any other number of scenarios. Though it does sound like you were genuine and she F'd up a bit. But that is not normal, I am sure you would agree to that?

You are in High School still, 9th graders, even well behaved ones are still very energetic. 50?

And all the kids were well behaved and active in the lesson, they were'nt asking question already answered 5 times, they followed directions, etc? Sure, there are bad teachers, but most teachers today are extremely professional and they have more training than you would believe.

Obama08 · 02-23-07, 09:16 PM

Shes a HUGE bitch.
I know what you're trying to say...but what about all the really good teachers that actually care and do a great job??? They have the same amount of kids to teach as the math teacher. If your going to go into a teaching profession you need to have the right attitude to do so.