Gamago25

LWNs, In so many words please defend your reasoning as to why an oppressive and terrorist sponsoring theocratic regime such as Iran's should continue to exist in a secular world with respect to human rights and freedoms?

Or do you believe that people should be governed and oppressed by religious rule?

And before you try to sidestep and point to other oppressive dictatorial nations, i dont agree with thier existance either, and support thier overthrow as well.

vauge

Welcome to Debate Politics.

I think alot of the negative from the liberals is just because Bush was involved. Nothing else.

Gamago25

This never surprises me that LWNs never try to defend this.

For all the arguements they make, this is the one they cant defend against

and hence, silence.......


The US has the right to initiate the overthrow of Iran's regime for moral reasons alone.

vandree

why? And what moral reasons are you talking about?

Gamago25

As explained above:

The MORAL reasons for installing a democratic and secular govt that respects religious freedoms and human rights (including for women) over the continued existence of oppressive regimes that dictate religious rule and oppression of human rights.

Sorry if you cant understand the concept of morality of democratic secularism over theocratic rule, in terms of human rights and religious freedom.

But most "progressives" cant.

GarzaUK

From Oxford Dictionary

liberal

1 willing to respect and accept behaviour or opinions different from one’s own.
2 (of a society, law, etc.) favourable to individual rights and freedoms.
3 (in a political context) favouring individual liberty, free trade, and moderate reform.
4 (Liberal) (in the UK) relating to the Liberal Democrat party.
7 (of education) concerned with broadening general knowledge and experience.

I don't why you assume that we don't want the Iranians to have freedom, freedom is everything liberals stand for. We are not for dictators like you assume we are, althougth U.S. republicans and democrats have supported and aided dictators and overthrew democracy leaders as well.

I have no doubt that given time every nation will turn to democracy, it seems to be the natural way of things. The west has been commited to help the young revoultion in Iran by both sides, so I don't know what your point is.

The most sucessful democracies are made by internal revolutions or the slow pace of time, not by force from an external foriegn force.
If the west helps with an internal revolution done by the Iranians themselves, I would fully support it.

The thing that amazes me the most is that Republicans are calling Iraq and Afghanistan a sucess, yet they have yet to last a full year in their democratic lifespan. You would be surprised how fragile democracy is, especially when it is starting.

__________________
They tried like hell. They called him an élitist, a radical, a socialist, a Marxist, a Muslim, an Arab, an appeaser, a danger to the republic, a threat to small children, a friend of terrorists, an enemy of Israel, a vote thief, a non-citizen, an anti-American, and a celebrity. ~ George Packer

GarzaUK

Do you know how hard it is for an Islamic nation to have a secular government? Eygpt possibly is secular, but is ruled by a dictator. Turkey is run by fundalmentalists. Iraq is certainly not secular.

Gamago25

""The west has been commited to help the young revoultion in Iran by both sides, so I don't know what your point is.""


1. Please state what "liberal" institutions are actively involved in formenting internal democratic revolution in Iran, besides the US and special forces.

2. Considering your statement that both sides of the political spectrum are helping an internal democratic revolution in Iran, then you are supportive for the overthrow of Iran's Clerical Regime?


Im for it, so i have no probs if you are for it also.

I'm talkin about those "liberals" who say we shouldnt be involved in the overthrow of the Clerical regime, period.


Love it or Leave it, Afghanistan/ Iraq were just stepping stones to the overthrow of theocratic rule in Iran.


I sleep better knowing this, progressive liberals dont.

Gamago25

I dont care how hard it is to install, it is morally just to have secular rule over theocratic rule, and until fanatical muslims in the middle east embrace this, they will continue to die until they embrace religious freedom and human rights for all.

The Secular world is tired of having religion being imposed by force and terror. After 9/11 we are striking back.

The US has the moral right to spread democracy, women's rights, and religious freedom over theocratic and dictatorial tyranny.

But "liberals" cry it's too hard, so they stick thier head in the sand and give up, or they convert to islam.

GarzaUK

Ah that says it all.

You see I'm getting confused here, because I thought this is what Bush was trying to do to secular America. Gay marriage, stem cell research ring any bells. Not by force and terror obviously, but imposed on nevertheless.[/quote]

I'm still waiting for the conservatives to create a pure secular Islam nation lol lol.