You Suck Microsoft: I'm getting a Mac

AGENT J said:

if your laptops are breaking/unstable after two years its operator error or the the laptop, not windows

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"Operator error." If I can't use the laptop the way I like without having to constantly deal with spyware, Adware, and viruses...and I'm expected to pay for things that should be standard...then it is the windows system too. I use my laptop as a media player. Also as a search device.

Windows just isn't good as a laptop system. It isn't stable or reliable.

stonewall50 said:

1.)"Operator error."
2.) If I can't use the laptop the way I like without having to constantly deal with spyware, Adware, and viruses
3.) ...and I'm expected to pay for things that should be standard...
4.) then it is the windows system too.
5.) I use my laptop as a media player. Also as a search device.
6.)Windows just isn't good as a laptop system.
7.) It isn't stable or reliable.

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1.) yes operator error or a ****y laptop
2.) weird i use my laptop however i want too and i dont have issues with any of that, so again its operrator error or a ****y laptop
3.) no clue what you are talking about here
4.) so far nothing you have said points to windows
5.) nothign wrong with thatm i use mine the same way and dont have the issues you speak of
6.) this sentence alone tells me you are confused about something . . . why do you keep saying "laptop" system
7.) again operator error or hardware.
yes windows does infact have its faults but typically under normal operations its pretty solid. Especially as a media player and search device. Under normal conditions that doesn't even drive a SYSTEM that hard let alone windows.

Of course you are free to "blame" windows but id bet fist full of dollars the issue is elsewhere

stonewall50 said:

"Operator error." If I can't use the laptop the way I like without having to constantly deal with spyware, Adware, and viruses...and I'm expected to pay for things that should be standard...then it is the windows system too. I use my laptop as a media player. Also as a search device.

Click to expand...

I felt the same way about my Corolla when I tried to tow my boat over the Rockies.

If I can't use the product the way I want to, the product is defective.

Seriously though, ime most of the malware these days comes from users not paying enough attention to what they are clicking on.

Macs won't stop you from installing bad programs either.

If you click install and then give your permission for the program to run, both Mac and PCs will let the program run.

There're many good choices for a computer out there.

It sounds like you're expecting something which isn't available though.

Declan said:

8.1 comes with so many pre-installed apps that it feels like adware. My biggest complaint is that there are some programs that once you open them, there is no way to close them easily--like one of the calculators. The only way I can get the full screen one to close is to go to the start button and search for something so it will give me the bar on the bottom back so I can close the calculator from it. There is no way to exit out of it I can find otherwise and even hitting the windows button when that thing is open won't get me anywhere.

Click to expand...

FYI - to close full-screen apps, leftclick in the middle-ish area of the very top of the screen (where the top bar of a normal window would be) and, still holding the mouse button down, drag all the way down to the bottom of the screen and let go. If you have one of those fancy touchscreen ma-thingies (clearly what the interface was designed for) you can just swipe with a finger from the very top to the very bottom.

Incidentally, you can also use this to snap the metro-apps to the left- or right-hand side of the screen and have the desktop interface open in the other half, which is sometimes handy. Just drag (in the same manner as above) to the far left or far right of the screen, rather than to the bottom.

I have been using Linux in various versions (aka "distros") for over 5 years.
There is a little patch of glue after the Windo$e sticker was ripped off of my computer (Tearing it off felt soooooo good!)
Linux is
free,
stable,
free,
tough to get a virus,
free,
can be installed on as many computers as you want,
free,
Great support forums,
free,
Install WINE on the computer to make games think they're on a Windo$e machine.
Did I mention that it is Free?

Dragonfly said:

LINUX

Try Linux Mint: Main Page - Linux Mint

#1) It's free - always (this is true for many Linux distros)
#2) You can burn a CD and boot to it so you can try it without installing it (this is true for many Linux distros)
#3) You can install it without over-writing anything else - dual boot - (this is true for many Linux distros)
#4) Comes with free alternatives to Word, Powerpoint, Excel... (this is true for many Linux distros)
#5) Easy to use and get started (this is true for many Linux distros)
#6) Did I mention it's FREE
#7) No need for virus or malware protection (this is true for many Linux distros)

Click to expand...

Got that right. I'm thinking for my next desktop. Try it out in a virtual machine first.

I've got an old XP Pro at home, that still works for what I use it for. I still have an old Office 2003 that works for what I need (although I've witched to 2010's Access and Excel).

Microsoft Office and Microsoft Windows are little more than means to extract money from consumers for things they don't need. Classic Microsoft motivation held up for example was when they introduced the new menu ribbon to the office apps.

It wasn't because the old toolbars weren't working, they were.
It wasn't because the new ribbon was better, it's not.
It wasn't because the new ribbon used the space on the screen better than the toolbars, it doesn't (16:9 wide screen loses height in favor of width, and the ribbon is fatter than the tool bars, taking yet more precious height from screen space for them = stupid decision).

The sole decision for needing to 'improve' the office apps with this stupid ribbon was that the old version of office wasn't selling enough for the desired cash flow. So, let's force everyone into an office app upgrade, paying for something that's actually worse than what was before!

And I absolutely can't stand the Windows 8 user interface. WFT? Is my desktop PC now a phone or a tablet? It's not. Why should I be forced into that?

Of course I won't self-inflict the ultimate vendor locking my chosing Apple either. (A hardware company that writes software to sell their hardware).

Naa. I'm thinking the next move forward is going to be to a Linux desktop. Dump all this stupid Microsoft crap, their stupid business and design decisions, etc.

So yeah. You suck Microsoft, and your software sucks too, and it's over priced for what it is.

Simon W. Moon said:

So why were you trying to make the case that the interface had not changed?

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Because it has not. The same functions are still there. The visual interface has changed that is all. To me an interface is far more than just the visual aspects.

Declan said:

8.1 comes with so many pre-installed apps that it feels like adware. My biggest complaint is that there are some programs that once you open them, there is no way to close them easily--like one of the calculators. The only way I can get the full screen one to close is to go to the start button and search for something so it will give me the bar on the bottom back so I can close the calculator from it. There is no way to exit out of it I can find otherwise and even hitting the windows button when that thing is open won't get me anywhere.

Click to expand...

It's the OEMs who ship preinstalled apps with windows. The product microsoft actually ship themselves is pretty vanilla.

Dragonfly said:

LINUX

Try Linux Mint: Main Page - Linux Mint

Click to expand...

SmokeAndMirrors said:

Give Linux a shot. I recommend Linux Mint main release.

Click to expand...

Linux is great for extending the life of an old machine, but unless you're going to put the time in to learn Bash, you're pretty limited as to what you can do (particularly with mint). If all you want a machine for is word processing, internet browsing and emails, then I'd say go with a chromebook. You get the simplicity, the lack of bloatware, but in a neat package with extraordinary battery life.

stonewall50 said:

I don't really have a working laptop right now. I don't need one. My next computer will be a desktop (of which I will HAVE to have Microsoft (Windows) because I want to play games.

BUT...I will never buy another Microsoft laptop. Additionally...I will do my best to never own a single Microsoft office product (PowerPoint, exel, word...I'm looking at you). Why? It is a rip off. The laptops are unstable and last 2 years. They want me to pay a subscription for all that crap? And the only thing holding me back from buying a Mac desktop is that they don't play games well (get off your ass Mac...there is huge market for a competitor who kicks Microsoft in the teeth for being such jerks).

Does anyone else hate Microsoft? Btw this is all spurred from using my girlfriends MacBook Air she got.

But seriously. No viruses. No irritating BS crap I have to constantly delete with subscriptions to anti virus programs (which probably made the damn viruses in the first place...because they aren't making money off me by annoying the hell out of me).

Click to expand...

Yep, I will agree that Micro$oft is crap. However, Apple's is not much better. Their iOS operating system for which they charge
an arm and a leg is nothing more than a tweaked version of FreeBSD which is a free operating system.
As such, Window$ games may or may not play nice on an Apple.

Nilly said:

Linux is great for extending the life of an old machine, but unless you're going to put the time in to learn Bash, you're pretty limited as to what you can do (particularly with mint). If all you want a machine for is word processing, internet browsing and emails, then I'd say go with a chromebook. You get the simplicity, the lack of bloatware, but in a neat package with extraordinary battery life.

Click to expand...

How so? I've done everything from video editing to layout design in Mint.

I'm completely terminal illiterate, and I didn't even know what you meant by "Bash" until I looked it up.

Linux/Mint is not limiting at all unless you're a prolific gamer (but then, Mac is too, if that's your bag).

Declan said:

8.1 comes with so many pre-installed apps that it feels like adware. My biggest complaint is that there are some programs that once you open them, there is no way to close them easily--like one of the calculators. The only way I can get the full screen one to close is to go to the start button and search for something so it will give me the bar on the bottom back so I can close the calculator from it. There is no way to exit out of it I can find otherwise and even hitting the windows button when that thing is open won't get me anywhere.

Click to expand...

It's really simple to close an app in Win8/8.1.

How do I close an app? - Windows Help

Nilly said:

Linux is great for extending the life of an old machine, but unless you're going to put the time in to learn Bash, you're pretty limited as to what you can do (particularly with mint). If all you want a machine for is word processing, internet browsing and emails, then I'd say go with a chromebook. You get the simplicity, the lack of bloatware, but in a neat package with extraordinary battery life.

Click to expand...

Nah, some users use linux and never use the command line at all; all GUI all the time. Bash, while helpful is not a pre-requisite.

stonewall50 said:

I don't really have a working laptop right now. I don't need one. My next computer will be a desktop (of which I will HAVE to have Microsoft (Windows) because I want to play games.

BUT...I will never buy another Microsoft laptop. Additionally...I will do my best to never own a single Microsoft office product (PowerPoint, exel, word...I'm looking at you). Why? It is a rip off. The laptops are unstable and last 2 years. They want me to pay a subscription for all that crap? And the only thing holding me back from buying a Mac desktop is that they don't play games well (get off your ass Mac...there is huge market for a competitor who kicks Microsoft in the teeth for being such jerks).

Does anyone else hate Microsoft? Btw this is all spurred from using my girlfriends MacBook Air she got.

But seriously. No viruses. No irritating BS crap I have to constantly delete with subscriptions to anti virus programs (which probably made the damn viruses in the first place...because they aren't making money off me by annoying the hell out of me).

Click to expand...

I hear ya, dude!! I have an HP Stream 7 tablet with Win8.1 on it and that damned thing won't play Crysis, for god's sake!! What's up with that, huh? Damned Win8.1 is freaking useless!!

/s


Seriously, though, I use Win8.1 on my $3500 desktop and on that tablet and they both work great. I also have the Win10 Technical Preview on my 6 y/o HP laptop and I can't wait for Win10 to be released. When it is, every freaking computer I own is going to be upgraded...for free.

Windows:

Pro:

• Runs on a wide variety of computer brands and makes.
• Widely used the world over.
• The standard for gaming.
• Pretty stable these days running on good hardware.
• A vast amount of available software.
• Lots of choices for boards such as graphics boards. Customization is easy. (The best motherboards and graphics boards don't come pre-installed in computers. You buy the boards and build a computer around them or you use them to do upgrades.
• Better for music production (so I hear)

Con:

• Performance depends a great deal on what computer it's running on.
• Number one target of viruses, trojans, malware, etc. Protective software manditory.
• Shift to apps with 8.0 has befuddled and annoyed some users.
• More maintainence. Needless to say, building a computer might be beyond the ability or interest of a lot of potential users.

OS X (Apple):

Pro:

• You can only get computers that run OS X from Apple, so it's uniformly stable
• Virus attacks rare
• Integrates with iPads and iPhones well.
• Less maintainence
• Cool, smooth interface, well designed

Con:

• You can only get computers that run OS X from Apple.
• More expensive.
• Software offerings more limited.
• You often can't get the cutting edge hardware for Apple. Customization is hard or impossible. The best graphics you can get on Apple computers doesn't even come close to matching what is made for the PC.

Nilly said:

It's the OEMs who ship preinstalled apps with windows. The product microsoft actually ship themselves is pretty vanilla.

Click to expand...

It also depends on what you consider "preinstalled" crapware. For example on the iPad or iPhone there is plenty of crapware that you also cant get rid off often.. also on the Mac. Hell even Linux distros come with tons of preinstalled stuff and never the stuff you want to use.

SmokeAndMirrors said:

How so? I've done everything from video editing to layout design in Mint.

I'm completely terminal illiterate, and I didn't even know what you meant by "Bash" until I looked it up.

Linux/Mint is not limiting at all unless you're a prolific gamer (but then, Mac is too, if that's your bag).

Click to expand...

uncleray said:

Nah, some users use linux and never use the command line at all; all GUI all the time. Bash, while helpful is not a pre-requisite.

Click to expand...

Ok so this will sound very snobby and I apologize in advance. Linux is great at a lot of things, but IMO to really get the most out of it you need to use the command line. Windows and Macs have a dedicated GUI, with linux, you're looking at GNOME, Unity, KDE etc because no single one has all the functionality/flexibility. The terminal really is the heart of linux. Things may have changed recently, but without it, a lot of simple tasks (unzipping certain file types, mounting ntfs drives rather than FAT32 ones) become unnecessarily complex, as some of the more holistic software packages (e.g. WinRAR/7zip) are only fully featured in command line form. If you run into an issue with a certain piece of software (Spotify, iTunes etc), you're on your own when it comes to trying to fix it. I used to dual boot mint (preceeded by a bunch of other distros, fedora etc) but every time I turned the computer on I'd end up choosing windows over it. I ended up spending more time worrying about compatibility then actually being productive.

There are a couple of niches for linux IMO. The first is the sysadmin power user, typing in commands etc, not really relevant here. The second is to extend the life of old hardware, which is where it excels. I turned an old laptop into one of these in the kitchen with ubuntu. The third, which is for users that want a no frills, clean streamlined experience. Mint (and a bunch of other distros) perform admirably here, but Chrome gives the fully fledged experience . It is, after all, a linux distro in and of itself. I've only used them briefly but they're awesome little things.

Obviously Mint/whatever works for you so that's great, it's not a wrong answer. I'd be remiss if I didn't give my honest recommendation to OP though!

LowDown said:

Windows:

Pro:

• Runs on a wide variety of computer brands and makes.
• Widely used the world over.
• The standard for gaming.
• Pretty stable these days running on good hardware.
• A vast amount of available software.
• Lots of choices for boards such as graphics boards. Customization is easy. (The best motherboards and graphics boards don't come pre-installed in computers. You buy the boards and build a computer around them or you use them to do upgrades.
• Better for music production (so I hear)

Con:

• Performance depends a great deal on what computer it's running on.
• Number one target of viruses, trojans, malware, etc. Protective software manditory.
• Shift to apps with 8.0 has befuddled and annoyed some users.
• More maintainence. Needless to say, building a computer might be beyond the ability or interest of a lot of potential users.

OS X (Apple):

Pro:

• You can only get computers that run OS X from Apple, so it's uniformly stable
• Virus attacks rare
• Integrates with iPads and iPhones well.
• Less maintainence
• Cool, smooth interface, well designed

Con:

• You can only get computers that run OS X from Apple.
• More expensive.
• Software offerings more limited.
• You often can't get the cutting edge hardware for Apple. Customization is hard or impossible. The best graphics you can get on Apple computers doesn't even come close to matching what is made for the PC.

Click to expand...

I don't know anything about Apple products, so I can't comment on that part...but your analysis on Windows PC's is right on target.

apple, selling souped up BSD and inferior, locked in hardware to status-conscious fanbois for the better part of a decade. PT Barnum would be proud

Nilly said:

Ok so this will sound very snobby and I apologize in advance. Linux is great at a lot of things, but IMO to really get the most out of it you need to use the command line. Windows and Macs have a dedicated GUI, with linux, you're looking at GNOME, Unity, KDE etc because no single one has all the functionality/flexibility. The terminal really is the heart of linux. Things may have changed recently, but without it, a lot of simple tasks (unzipping certain file types, mounting ntfs drives rather than FAT32 ones) become unnecessarily complex, as some of the more holistic software packages (e.g. WinRAR/7zip) are only fully featured in command line form. If you run into an issue with a certain piece of software (Spotify, iTunes etc), you're on your own when it comes to trying to fix it. I used to dual boot mint (preceeded by a bunch of other distros, fedora etc) but every time I turned the computer on I'd end up choosing windows over it. I ended up spending more time worrying about compatibility then actually being productive.

There are a couple of niches for linux IMO. The first is the sysadmin power user, typing in commands etc, not really relevant here. The second is to extend the life of old hardware, which is where it excels. I turned an old laptop into one of these in the kitchen with ubuntu. The third, which is for users that want a no frills, clean streamlined experience. Mint (and a bunch of other distros) perform admirably here, but Chrome gives the fully fledged experience . It is, after all, a linux distro in and of itself. I've only used them briefly but they're awesome little things.

Obviously Mint/whatever works for you so that's great, it's not a wrong answer. I'd be remiss if I didn't give my honest recommendation to OP though!

Click to expand...

Not if you're not a geek, you don't.

Mint has gotten good at compatibility. In fact, it's always been good at compatibility. That's the point of it. It adjusts to the user, not the other way around. That is why "desktop Linux" exists -- for those of us who want a simple experience. Unzipping something is a one-click operation in Mint, just like it is in Windows. Formatting a drive is also a one-click oepration, and has been for a while. I've never run into something in the manager that simply didn't work. Compatibility is the heart of Mint. You'd have to have neglected your updates for probably years before the packages just wouldn't work.

I really don't know what you're on about with it being "complex." I've never had problems with anything apart from an experimental LMDE release (got talked into it by a geek -- now I know better), and a couple sound-related bugs. I've been using Mint for 6 years, and even back when I started, it was still pretty darn straight-forward. Everything just works. That's the point of Mint. Hell, even my touch screen works without any fiddling necessary.

Apart from the software manager -- which, if anything, is way easier than Windows -- I struggle to think of anything that is substantially different from the other OS's. It's just better-performing. But it functions exactly the same way.

Honestly, I ran into way more problems when I was running Windows. Windows seems to break itself with every update, in one way or another. It seems to only get more bloated and less functional as time goes on. I don't miss it in the slightest.

Declan said:

8.1 comes with so many pre-installed apps that it feels like adware. My biggest complaint is that there are some programs that once you open them, there is no way to close them easily--like one of the calculators. The only way I can get the full screen one to close is to go to the start button and search for something so it will give me the bar on the bottom back so I can close the calculator from it. There is no way to exit out of it I can find otherwise and even hitting the windows button when that thing is open won't get me anywhere.

Click to expand...

If this has already been said then I apologize. But all apps on win 8.1 can be closed by simply dragging the bar that appears when your mouse is near the top down towards the bottom of the screen and then letting go. It will close the app.

But yeah, I know what stonewall50 is saying. Microsoft sucks in a lot of ways and Apple is far superior comparatively speaking. Yes, virus's and such can still get on Macs but it is much harder. ANY software is subject to virus's. That's simply the way human made products go and it applies to anything built by man. One of my favorite sayings is "what one man can build up, another man can tear down".

Kal'Stang said:

If this has already been said then I apologize. But all apps on win 8.1 can be closed by simply dragging the bar that appears when your mouse is near the top down towards the bottom of the screen and then letting go. It will close the app.

But yeah, I know what stonewall50 is saying. Microsoft sucks in a lot of ways and Apple is far superior comparatively speaking. Yes, virus's and such can still get on Macs but it is much harder. ANY software is subject to virus's. That's simply the way human made products go and it applies to anything built by man. One of my favorite sayings is "what one man can build up, another man can tear down".

Click to expand...

More appropriately, when people can download stuff illegally for free, hard to claim to be a victim when your illegal downloads contain malware.

stonewall50 said:

I don't really have a working laptop right now. I don't need one. My next computer will be a desktop (of which I will HAVE to have Microsoft (Windows) because I want to play games.

BUT...I will never buy another Microsoft laptop. Additionally...I will do my best to never own a single Microsoft office product (PowerPoint, exel, word...I'm looking at you). Why? It is a rip off. The laptops are unstable and last 2 years. They want me to pay a subscription for all that crap? And the only thing holding me back from buying a Mac desktop is that they don't play games well (get off your ass Mac...there is huge market for a competitor who kicks Microsoft in the teeth for being such jerks).

Does anyone else hate Microsoft? Btw this is all spurred from using my girlfriends MacBook Air she got.

But seriously. No viruses. No irritating BS crap I have to constantly delete with subscriptions to anti virus programs (which probably made the damn viruses in the first place...because they aren't making money off me by annoying the hell out of me).

Click to expand...

I wasn't aware Microsoft made laptops.

The only negative experience I've had with Microsoft products is Windows8 & 8.1, and even then it wasn't a world ender. I don't believe I've ever had to pay a subscription for an OS or any Office product so I'm not sure what you're talking about.

Dragonfly said:

#4) Comes with free alternatives to Word, Powerpoint, Excel... (this is true for many Linux distros)

Click to expand...

And these alternatives are compatible with Office? They can read Office and Office can read them?

Dragonfly said:

#7) No need for virus or malware protection (this is true for many Linux distros)

Click to expand...

There's always a need for virus and malware protection.

Jerry said:

I wasn't aware Microsoft made laptops.

The only negative experience I've had with Microsoft products is Windows8 & 8.1, and even then it wasn't a world ender. I don't believe I've ever had to pay a subscription for an OS or any Office product so I'm not sure what you're talking about.

Click to expand...

You won't ever have to pay a subscription for a Windows OS, but there are MS products you can pay a subscription for: Office, Skype, OneDrive, etc.

Now, there are deals to be had, I got a free year of Office when I bought my tablet, I've gotten hundreds of GB's of OneDrive storage for free, etc.

And, of course, there are always alternatives to those MS products that cost little to nothing.

And no, MS doesn't make laptops though they like to think the Surface 3 can replace a laptop.