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Are abortion debates meaningless?

Bodhisattva said:
Bucky didn't mention or refer to Christianity once...
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He has discussed his religion elsewhere.

You are aware of Who Bush and Obama were praying to, in his post, correct?
 
GEIxBattleRifle said:
I'm an Atheist with my own set of morals and ethics no God required.
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I respect that. "Love your neighbor as yourself." Religious tolerance and respect are a pillar of Christianity.
 
Bodhisattva said:
One side wants to be able to kill their children and the other wants to protect humans from being slaughtered...
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One side understands that fetuses are not children and the other side thinks children are fetuses still in the womb.
 
Moot said:
One side understands that fetuses are not children and the other side thinks children are fetuses still in the womb.
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One side plays with semantics and the other side understands that a fully developed child 1 day from birth is actually a child...
 
Bodhisattva said:
One side plays with semantics and the other side understands that a fully developed child 1 day from birth is actually a child...
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One side knows the difference between a fetus and a child and the other side doesn't..as you have already shown.
 
Moot said:
One side knows the difference between a fetus and a child and the other side doesn't..as you have already shown.
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A fetus and a child are synonomous...I am honest about it, yo uare not. I am also pro-choice. Gives me more credibility then you... end of story. Done.
 
akrunner88 said:
And so it begins.
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Yep . . . .
simply dont let it bother you.
Whats your stance, why and if it was up to you what would you change or wouldnt you change.
 
AGENT J said:
Yep . . . .
simply dont let it bother you.
Whats your stance, why and if it was up to you what would you change or wouldnt you change.
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I like how things are now. Restrictions on third trimesters with exceptions for obvious cases such as health and safety of the mother. I place value on the argument of viability and think that the third trimester crosses a line.
 
akrunner88 said:
I like how things are now. Restrictions on third trimesters with exceptions for obvious cases such as health and safety of the mother. I place value on the argument of viability and think that the third trimester crosses a line.
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I see nothign wrong with that view at all. Mine is different but to each their own.

If it was up to me i would move RvW to 20/21 weeks because 21 weeks is the earliest possible viability. I would also legislate fetal rights so they were clear and established at this time. All the current exceptions would still be in place, its rare any abortions after 20 weeks are not for the restrictions anyway.

theres a ton of other stuff i would do but it involves things like paternal rights, and healthcare, social programs, sex ed and adoption/child services/ foster care reform etc Ill just keep it short for now.
 
Damn good question. For 40 years we have had bad governance as people have voted on their fears about abortion rights being curtailed.
But I guess that is human nature-to live in fear.
 
akrunner88 said:
Abortion, more so than any other issue I can think of in American politics is so partisan, so pig-headed, so extreme to the opposite sides of the spectrum, so full of hyperbole and emotion on both sides, that I think it's almost literally pointless to discuss. Every single thread in this forum, without question usually degenerates into the same line of debate, regardless of the OP.

Why do we frustrate ourselves with this topic so frequently?
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If you have ever looked at the academic debates at the beginning of the last century about euthanasia, you will find the same arguments.
 
Eric7216 said:
Damn good question. For 40 years we have had bad governance as people have voted on their fears about abortion rights being curtailed.
But I guess that is human nature-to live in fear.
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True. But fear is also a poor advisor.
 
GEIxBattleRifle said:
What do you mean?
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I think he means that one side wants everyone to have the right to make up their own minds and the other wants to enforce obedience to their opinion. And I agree with him. Beware giving power to the theocrats. Before long they will be hanging witches and burning heretics.
 
Bucky said:
Absolutely not, but we are a Christian nation. It would be really hard to dispute otherwise.

I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

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I hope that there are Americans who refuse to utter the 'under god' words. Freedom of religion must include freedom from religion, otherwise any pretense of being a free country is mere hypocrisy.
 
Bucky said:
Any strong nation needs to be have a foundation of strong ethics, morals and principles. Without it, we would cease to be a nation and everyone basic rights would be stripped.
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Ethics, morals, and principles have absolutely NOTHING to do with religion.
 
This forum is too much fun.

But to be on topic, I'm glad I'm not the only one, OP.
 
Bucky said:
Absolutely not, but we are a Christian nation. It would be really hard to dispute otherwise.

I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

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NO!!!!!!!!

We are a nation with Christians. Not a Christian nation.

By the way. Tell me why and when the "under God" entered the pledge.
 
GEIxBattleRifle said:
What do you mean?
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The First amendment grants US citizens religious liberty.
Pro choice allows all religions and secular people religious liberty.

... However, the First Amendment makes clear that public policy is not to be based on faith alone – in a religiously diverse, pluralistic society, favoring any one religious worldview is wrong and inherently biased. Good policy is policy that allows for all people – regardless of their religious identity – to follow their own faith and conscience when directing the course of their life. When it comes to matters of reproductive health, RCRC believes that real religious liberty protects the right of a woman to make thoughtful decisions in private consultation with her doctor, her family, and her own faith. Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual.
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Religious Liberty | Religious Coalition For Reproductive Choice
 
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Bucky said:
If my message can help one young girl or couple from making a haste life altering decision, it's all worth the fight and effort.
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Only if they make that choice of their own free will, not pressured, shamed or coerced in any way.
 
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