• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks [W:211, **303**]

Schwartz

Banned
Joined
Mar 22, 2015
Messages
282
Reaction score
157
Location
USA
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
"I didn't need my parents to tell me that every child is a gift from God. But let me tell you, they did -- early and often. Because that respect -- that sanctity and dignity -- is everything," a teary Boehner said.

House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks - CNNPolitics.com

Why is it so important for Boehner and his colleagues to discriminate against women and protect mythical fetus' rights? What's the reason behind? They only abortion Mr. Boehner should be worried about is his wife's. It doesn't give him a right to terminate her pregnancy though. Even his daughters have a right to do whatever they want to their bodies. So why he is trying to take this right away from American women?
One more thing. When people turn to religious it-is-in-God's-will arguments it means they've lost already.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks - CNNPolitics.com

Why is it so important for Boehner and his colleagues to discriminate against women and protect mythical fetus' rights? What's the reason behind? They only abortion Mr. Boehner should be worried about is his wife's. It doesn't give him a right to terminate her pregnancy though. Even his daughters have a right to do whatever they want to their bodies. So why he is trying to take this right away from American women?
One more thing. When people turn to religious it-is-in-God's-will arguments it means they've lost already.

You might want to ask why anyone would want to discriminate against anyone. In this context humans under 20 weeks come to mind. ;)
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks - CNNPolitics.com

Why is it so important for Boehner and his colleagues to discriminate against women and protect mythical fetus' rights? What's the reason behind? They only abortion Mr. Boehner should be worried about is his wife's. It doesn't give him a right to terminate her pregnancy though. Even his daughters have a right to do whatever they want to their bodies. So why he is trying to take this right away from American women?
One more thing. When people turn to religious it-is-in-God's-will arguments it means they've lost already.

Even if you disagree with their stance, it's absolutely simple to understand "why" they find this so important. It just requires on to actually be intellectually honest regarding the situation and attempt to be even mildly objective when viewing their actions through the prism of their views.

Boehner and the others are of a belief that said "fetus" is a child regardless of whether it's in the mother's body or not. Specific to this bill, they feel that is the case at 20 weeks within the pregnancy process. As such, they find this is so "important" just as they would find it "important" that the state have an ability to step in if a parents is attempting to kill a 5 year old because it's costing them too much money, or having a negative impact on their emotional well being, or because they don't think they could provide the right kind of life for that 5 year old, or whatever other reason.

While I recognize that you and others don't particularly view a fetus as being a "child", that does not mean these individuals do not. And judging their actions through an assumptive lens that completely ignores that key factor of their thinking, and judging/questioning their motives after doing so, is not just laughable but patentedly dishonest.

While I absolutely have zero concern or interesting the "Gods Will" argument, I fully recognize the absolute fact that "person" or "child", and what it is from a legal or societal stand point, is an entirely subjective notion that is entirely subject to the methods and means in which a person decides they wish to form their opinion. There is no magical neon light hovering over every human's head that suddenly flares into flourescent luminescense saying "PERSON" at a specific measurable period of time. The reality is that the designation is one entirely based first and foremost around individuals opinions.

As such, while I may disagree with the bill itself, I can also fully see a reasonable and logically consistent thought process with regards to the Republicans in the House pushing this bill that has nothing to do with having an intent and desire to strip away "women's rights" but rather a concern over the "childs" rights and acting in the way the US Government has acted since it's inception....weighing the rights of two seperate groups when those rights conflict with each other and creating laws to deal with those conflicts. In this case, they place the deliniating line 20 weeks. Prior to 20 weeks, the rights of the mother outweigh the rights of the child. After 20 weeks, the rights of the child outweigh the rights of the mother.

The reason this debate will continue to rage on in such a futile and ridiculous matter is because there are too many ideologues and hyper partisan types on both sides that continually and routinely refuse to actually engage in reasonable discussion or have any compunction what so ever to actually understand and recognize what and why the arguments actually are by the other side, but instead debate and argue simply and singularly based upon their bigoted stereotypes they've created in their own mind and have deluded themselves into believing is somehow reality.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Unsure how this will get through the Senate but what a mess Republicans have decided to put up headed right into 2016.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Even if you disagree with their stance, it's absolutely simple to understand "why" they find this so important. It just requires on to actually be intellectually honest regarding the situation and attempt to be even mildly objective when viewing their actions through the prism of their views.

Boehner and the others are of a belief that said "fetus" is a child regardless of whether it's in the mother's body or not. Specific to this bill, they feel that is the case at 20 weeks within the pregnancy process. As such, they find this is so "important" just as they would find it "important" that the state have an ability to step in if a parents is attempting to kill a 5 year old because it's costing them too much money, or having a negative impact on their emotional well being, or because they don't think they could provide the right kind of life for that 5 year old, or whatever other reason.

While I recognize that you and others don't particularly view a fetus as being a "child", that does not mean these individuals do not. And judging their actions through an assumptive lens that completely ignores that key factor of their thinking, and judging/questioning their motives after doing so, is not just laughable but patentedly dishonest.

While I absolutely have zero concern or interesting the "Gods Will" argument, I fully recognize the absolute fact that "person" or "child", and what it is from a legal or societal stand point, is an entirely subjective notion that is entirely subject to the methods and means in which a person decides they wish to form their opinion. There is no magical neon light hovering over every human's head that suddenly flares into flourescent luminescense saying "PERSON" at a specific measurable period of time. The reality is that the designation is one entirely based first and foremost around individuals opinions.

As such, while I may disagree with the bill itself, I can also fully see a reasonable and logically consistent thought process with regards to the Republicans in the House pushing this bill that has nothing to do with having an intent and desire to strip away "women's rights" but rather a concern over the "childs" rights and acting in the way the US Government has acted since it's inception....weighing the rights of two seperate groups when those rights conflict with each other and creating laws to deal with those conflicts. In this case, they place the deliniating line 20 weeks. Prior to 20 weeks, the rights of the mother outweigh the rights of the child. After 20 weeks, the rights of the child outweigh the rights of the mother.

The reason this debate will continue to rage on in such a futile and ridiculous matter is because there are too many ideologues and hyper partisan types on both sides that continually and routinely refuse to actually engage in reasonable discussion or have any compunction what so ever to actually understand and recognize what and why the arguments actually are by the other side, but instead debate and argue simply and singularly based upon their bigoted stereotypes they've created in their own mind and have deluded themselves into believing is somehow reality.

Thanks for your comment, sir.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks - CNNPolitics.com

Why is it so important for Boehner and his colleagues to discriminate against women and protect mythical fetus' rights?
Because he and the rest of his cronies are douche bags.

What's the reason behind?
Pandering to ignorant religious zealots.

One more thing. When people turn to religious it-is-in-God's-will arguments it means they've lost already.
Many are too stupid to realize that.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Even if you disagree with their stance, it's absolutely simple to understand "why" they find this so important.
Because they are control freaks?

It just requires on to actually be intellectually honest regarding the situation and attempt to be even mildly objective when viewing their actions through the prism of their views.
Their views are irrelevant. They can live their own lives according to any views they wish, but what gives them the right to impose those ignorant views on society?

Boehner and the others are of a belief that said "fetus" is a child regardless of whether it's in the mother's body or not.
As I said what they believe is irrelevant, but in this particular case they are just attempting to please religious zealots. Talk about honesty, intellectual or general.

Specific to this bill, they feel that is the case at 20 weeks within the pregnancy process. As such, they find this is so "important" just as they would find it "important" that the state have an ability to step in if a parents is attempting to kill a 5 year old because it's costing them too much money, or having a negative impact on their emotional well being, or because they don't think they could provide the right kind of life for that 5 year old, or whatever other reason.
Are we to understand that they are supporting elective abortion prior to 20 weeks?

While I recognize that you and others don't particularly view a fetus as being a "child", that does not mean these individuals do not.
And again, why or how is their view trumping facts or reality?

As such, while I may disagree with the bill itself, I can also fully see a reasonable and logically consistent thought process with regards to the Republicans in the House pushing this bill that has nothing to do with having an intent and desire to strip away "women's rights" but rather a concern over the "childs" rights and acting in the way the US Government has acted since it's inception....weighing the rights of two seperate groups when those rights conflict with each other and creating laws to deal with those conflicts. In this case, they place the deliniating line 20 weeks. Prior to 20 weeks, the rights of the mother outweigh the rights of the child. After 20 weeks, the rights of the child outweigh the rights of the mother.
And in the absence of the magical neon sign, what makes 20 weeks relevant?
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Money well spent by "conservatives"
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

You might want to ask why anyone would want to discriminate against anyone. In this context humans under 20 weeks come to mind. ;)

What do newborns have to do with this?
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks - CNNPolitics.com

Why is it so important for Boehner and his colleagues to discriminate against women and protect mythical fetus' rights? What's the reason behind? They only abortion Mr. Boehner should be worried about is his wife's. It doesn't give him a right to terminate her pregnancy though. Even his daughters have a right to do whatever they want to their bodies. So why he is trying to take this right away from American women?
One more thing. When people turn to religious it-is-in-God's-will arguments it means they've lost already.

A better question is why they are wasting time with more bills that have no chance at becoming law? Are they that stupid or is this just a sham?
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Unsure how this will get through the Senate but what a mess Republicans have decided to put up headed right into 2016.

And the President said he'll veto.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Money well spent by "conservatives"

It may be. With the big election year coming up, they may want people to believe they'll see more of this under a Republican administration.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

And the President said he'll veto.

Of course he will, it all comes down to Congressional votes. And I do not see enough of them, making this nothing more than a political stunt.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

A better question is why they are wasting time with more bills that have no chance at becoming law? Are they that stupid or is this just a sham?

It may be. With the big election year coming up, they may want people to believe they'll see more of this under a Republican administration.
.....
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks - CNNPolitics.com

Why is it so important for Boehner and his colleagues to discriminate against women and protect mythical fetus' rights? What's the reason behind? They only abortion Mr. Boehner should be worried about is his wife's. It doesn't give him a right to terminate her pregnancy though. Even his daughters have a right to do whatever they want to their bodies. So why he is trying to take this right away from American women?
One more thing. When people turn to religious it-is-in-God's-will arguments it means they've lost already.

If I recall, there are very few nations and / or places on this planet which allow abortion after 20 weeks gestation, so I have to ask, why is passing this bill such a big deal? It seems more like a policy / law that's falling in line with the rest of peoples / nations.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Why is it so unreasonable to ban abortions after 20 weeks?
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Why is it so unreasonable to ban abortions after 20 weeks?


It threatens to put an obstetrician in jail for caring for any pregnancy with complications after 20 weeks. If this legislation becomes law, a woman whose water breaks at 21 weeks gestation would be legally forced to have a Cesarean delivery in order to protect the “life” of a non-viable baby since the process of labor usually results in death of the baby at this gestational age.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Why is it so unreasonable to ban abortions after 20 weeks?

For one thing, it's almost never done. 98.5% occur in the first 12 weeks. The ones after that are almost, without exception, for medical necessity...the mother's health or a severely defective fetus. No woman/parents should be judged on her decisions for things like that, or even have them opened up to govt scrutiny. It's painful and private. Medical records are confidential even for most homicides....to invade a woman's privacy unnecessarily is just one more chip into women's rights.

Also, women do not have late term abortions like that casually. At that point, the procedure is as painful and dangerous as childbirth. In many cases it IS induced childbirth of a dead fetus. Horrible for the mother or parents. If someone didnt 'want' a kid, they would have decided alot earlier or at that point, just given birth and just give it up for adoption.

The whole 'pain' thing is bull****, btw, as ANY abortion is painless for the unborn. In later term abortions, anesthesia is administered to the fetus. The injection causes painless death.

It is useless, feel-good, medically dishonest legislation for political aggrandizement created to prey on the ignorant.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

If I recall, there are very few nations and / or places on this planet which allow abortion after 20 weeks gestation, so I have to ask, why is passing this bill such a big deal? It seems more like a policy / law that's falling in line with the rest of peoples / nations.

Why is it so unreasonable to ban abortions after 20 weeks?

If abortion is okay at 10 weeks, why not at 20 weeks?

I am against a ban at any stage as it is not for govt. to practice medicine.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

It threatens to put an obstetrician in jail for caring for any pregnancy with complications after 20 weeks. If this legislation becomes law, a woman whose water breaks at 21 weeks gestation would be legally forced to have a Cesarean delivery in order to protect the “life” of a non-viable baby since the process of labor usually results in death of the baby at this gestational age.

A huge invasion of medical privacy which would still be protecting men...but not women.

The police are rarely given access to private medical records in homicide investigations without the individual's consent. To do so just to 'keep tabs' on women's pregnancies? Ugh, just flush the Constititution then (for women, not men of course!)
 
Last edited:
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

If abortion is okay at 10 weeks, why not at 20 weeks?

I am against a ban at any stage as it is not for govt. to practice medicine.

I'm not a fan of Hillary...HOWEVER...I agree with her comment below.

This bill is a direct challenge to Roe v. Wade, which has protected a woman's constitutional right to privacy for over forty years. The bill puts women's health and rights at risk, undermines the role doctors play in health care decisions, burdens survivors of sexual assault, and is not based on sound science. It also follows a dangerous trend we are witnessing across the country. In just the first three months of 2015, more than 300 bills have been introduced in state legislatures -- on top of the nearly 30 measures introduced in Congress -- that restrict access to abortion. Politicians should not interfere with personal medical decisions, which should be left to a woman, her family and her faith, in consultation with her doctor or health care provider.

U.S. House Passes Abortion Ban That Could Challenge Roe V. Wade [UPDATE]
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

If abortion is okay at 10 weeks, why not at 20 weeks?

I am against a ban at any stage as it is not for govt. to practice medicine.

Don't think characterizing it as the government 'practicing medicine' is really accurate.

Granted, I've not read the bill, but my point was that most civilized societies have pretty much arrived at a consensus that after 20 weeks gestation abortions shouldn't be allowed with exception of medical need, to save the mother's life.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

Over time, improvements in medical science has reduced the age of viability. Over time it will logically get lower. If you believe that viability is a reasonable cutoff, then you will eventually be left with conception as the cutoff.
 
Re: House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks

House passes bill banning abortions after 20 weeks - CNNPolitics.com

Why is it so important for Boehner and his colleagues to discriminate against women and protect mythical fetus' rights? What's the reason behind? They only abortion Mr. Boehner should be worried about is his wife's. It doesn't give him a right to terminate her pregnancy though. Even his daughters have a right to do whatever they want to their bodies. So why he is trying to take this right away from American women?
One more thing. When people turn to religious it-is-in-God's-will arguments it means they've lost already.

I really wish these news organizations would include the bill number. Anyway, after some searching, I found it:

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-114hr36ih/pdf/BILLS-114hr36ih.pdf
 
Back
Top Bottom