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Poll: 85% for Obama, 4% for Romney [W:53]

German guy said:
It's true, we don't have a general minimum wage yet. But the current situation, as far as I know, is that when your wage is below the minimum level, the government gives you some additional money to meet the minimum.

The more left-leaning parties, most notably the center-left Social Democrats (major left-leaning party in Germany) and the socialist Left Party (small far-left party) demand the introduction of a general minimum wage.

Even Christian Democrat (major right-leaning party in Germany) Chancellor Merkel fueled some rumors about introducing a minimum wage, but her junior coalition partner, the libertarians, were against it.

Chances are we'll see another "great coalition" of the two major parties from left and right again after the next election, in which case the introduction of a general minimum wage is likely.
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How do you feel about that. You for it or against it?
 
poweRob said:
How do you feel about that. You for it or against it?
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I'm not sure. The right claims a minimum wage will destroy many jobs, because it no longer pays off for employers to hire people when they have to pay them such a high wage ... and I believe it's still better when people work at least a bit (and get some additional support by the government), than doing no work at all.

On the other side, the left says that most Western countries have minimum wages, and it has not negatively impacted their job market.

So I'm not sure. Maybe I should try to look deeper into the subject. When I find a minimum wage does not destroy jobs, I agree with it.
 
Moderator's Warning:
Discuss the topic, not each other and the personal feelings you might harbor for other DP members. Please. I have a headache and you're making it worse. You know who I'm talking about. Thank you with sugar on it.
 
German guy said:
I'm not sure. The right claims a minimum wage will destroy many jobs, because it no longer pays off for employers to hire people when they have to pay them such a high wage ... and I believe it's still better when people work at least a bit (and get some additional support by the government), than doing no work at all.

On the other side, the left says that most Western countries have minimum wages, and it has not negatively impacted their job market.

So I'm not sure. Maybe I should try to look deeper into the subject. When I find a minimum wage does not destroy jobs, I agree with it.
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Interesting how the government subsidizes employee wages basically... sure could help businesses while making sure poverty levels don't make a bad situation worse. Dunno what I think about that either. I'd have to investigate that myself.
 
German guy said:
.. in Germany.

ZEIT-ONLINE-Umfrage: Deutsche beurteilen Obamas Amtszeit positiv | Politik | ZEIT ONLINE

Of course the Germans are not allowed to vote the American President, and most Americans don't care what Europeans think ... but for the sake of curiosity, I thought I'd share this poll with you.

According to the YouGov poll institute, 85% of the Germans would vote for Barack Obama, only 4% for Mitt Romney (11%: Don't know/no comment).

According to this poll, Romney even scored worse than McCain four years ago, who enjoyed the sympathy of 8% of the Germans (compared to 80% for Obama, IIRC).

The YouGov poll also found that 60% of the Germans think Obama's policies in the past four years have been "positive on the bottom line", only 4% believe it was "negative on the bottom line", while 33% say "it was mixed" or "don't know".

I guess that makes Germany an even bluer constituency than Washington DC. ;)
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What I find more interesting, removing the don't knows is how it has changed from 2004 to 2012. Remember in 2004 he was fighting against Bush, who was a cowboy, had started 2 wars and was certainly not a moderate. Still, Europeans liked Bush better.

I also don't like Mitt Romney despite being to the right of most Europeans. I just see him as a phony. How can I support a guy who keeps lying, who says he doesn't care about half of the population, who is socially awkward, and who does not inspire me. In that case I prefer Obama.

Obama/Romney:
Canada: Obama: 89 Romney: 11
United Kingdom: Obama: 91 Romney: 9
Germany: Obama: 95.5 Romney: 4.5
Sweden: Obama: 96, Romney: 4
France: Obama: 97 Romney: 3

Bush/Kerry:
United Kingdom: Kerry: 75 Bush: 25
Canada: Kerry: 79 Bush: 21
Sweden: Kerry: 85, Bush 15
Germany: Kerry: 88 Bush: 12
France: Kerry: 93 Bush: 7

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-20008687
http://drum.lib.umd.edu/bitstream/1903/10664/3/USElection_Sep04_rpt.pdf
 
Paul Austin said:
Out of interest how informed of the candidates are the German people?

I'm in England at the moment & a lot of the public dont really know a lot about Romney. In fact I know a few people who dont even know who he is, so when I see a poll in the UK where Obama trounces Romney I know its got absolutely nothing to do with politics, for the most part & everything to do with picking that "cool black guy who looks a bit like Will Smith, you know, Men in Black, Fresh Prince, everyone used to love that show & everyone still remembers the lyrics to the theme tune & oh yeah we seen clips of Obama dancing & doing one liners on that show with the host with the huge chin so yeah we'd vote for him".

I was just wondering if it was anymore scientific in Germany?
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The news in Germany is pretty good. I believe the Germans know more about the US than most of us know and certainly more than we know about Europe. The media also has different views as well some liberal, some conservative and some neutral. take your pick
 
Camlon said:
What I find more interesting, removing the don't knows is how it has changed from 2004 to 2012. Remember in 2004 he was fighting against Bush, who was a cowboy, had started 2 wars and was certainly not a moderate. Still, Europeans liked Bush better.

I also don't like Mitt Romney despite being to the right of most Europeans. I just see him as a phony. How can I support a guy who keeps lying, who says he doesn't care about half of the population, who is socially awkward, and who does not inspire me. In that case I prefer Obama.

Obama/Romney:
Canada: Obama: 89 Romney: 11
United Kingdom: Obama: 91 Romney: 9
Germany: Obama: 95.5 Romney: 4.5
Sweden: Obama: 96, Romney: 4
France: Obama: 97 Romney: 3

Bush/Kerry:
United Kingdom: Kerry: 75 Bush: 25
Canada: Kerry: 79 Bush: 21
Sweden: Kerry: 85, Bush 15
Germany: Kerry: 88 Bush: 12
France: Kerry: 93 Bush: 7

BBC News - BBC poll: Rest of world favours Obama
http://drum.lib.umd.edu/bitstream/1903/10664/3/USElection_Sep04_rpt.pdf
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I find this amusing while irrelevant. Obama basically failed every standard he set for himself. But I couldn't care less what people who honestly don't count in this issue care about. Romney is smarter and more successful than Obama and he does not demonize success. That alone is enough to support Mitt
 
ksu_aviator said:
I know it is trite...but they also voted for Hitler...so there's that.
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OH what? They voted for Hitler? really. When was the last time you were physically threatened at a voting station. When was the last time someone looked at who you voted for. When was the last time you were harassed to the point that you knew which way the wind was blowing. Thats how many Germans VOTED for Hitler.

Voting in Germany today is more or less democratic and is not public and there is no one harrassing you. Americans need to get over their misinformed love of all things Hitler and learn the truth.

Just because this happened in Germany then does not have anything to do with Germany today.

Its like comparing our treatment of blacks and indians with modern day America.
 
German guy said:
I'm not sure. The right claims a minimum wage will destroy many jobs, because it no longer pays off for employers to hire people when they have to pay them such a high wage ... and I believe it's still better when people work at least a bit (and get some additional support by the government), than doing no work at all.
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The right is focused on the wrong topics. Minimum wage is not what is causing structural unemployment in the US. Other factors tend to be much more important than minimum wage. For instance if you make it very difficult, costly, time consuming and risky to hire people and open a business, then less people are going to get hired and unemployment will stay high. That is the most important reason for the high unemployment rate.

Notice how unemployment tend to stay quite low till a crisis and then notice how long time it takes to go back to normal employment after a crisis. That is clearly a sign of an economy who has destroyed nearly all job creation. Only in very good times, some jobs can get created. If people could just hire a person with no strings attached, then a lot more people would.

Minimum wage in America is so low that it really doesn't matter. If it was lower, then people would rather stay on welfare. The only states that are getting affected by the minimum wage is probably Mississippi and Puerto Rico. Germany wouldn't get hurt by adopting a minimum wage, but would get hurt if they try to push it up too high like France is doing. Still as pointed out earlier there are other factors that are much more important for job creation.
 
German guy said:
Well, I was glad that for a change, an American President would not just show us the finger or tell us to "shut up and do as I say", but actually treat us like Allies (which I always assumed we are).

If that's "bowing down and apologizing for the existence of his country" ... well, let me say that's a rather egocentric view.
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Yep Bush sure was in favor of his new world order. Do what I say and I can ignore any treaty I want to cause my dog is bigger than your and I don't know nothin about you folks.
 
So European socialists prefer the American candidate that wants to emulate their failed, parasitic ideology. So where is the news here?
 
poweRob said:
What is funny about this is Germany has, what they call, a "conservative" government right now. You just know that their conservatives look at ours with mouths agape with a thought bubble floating over their heads containing the letters... "WTF?!" :lol:
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Can I get a BIG amen to that AMMMMEEEENNNN. Wunderschon.
 
Fletch said:
So European socialists prefer the American candidate that wants to emulate their failed, parasitic ideology. So where is the news here?
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we call them "Fellow travelers"
 
German guy said:
I sympathize with you secretly, but hey, I'm German too and just a child of my environment, so what am I supposed to say? ;)

But I think we Germans can suck big time too rather often.

Our pacifism is too extreme... we always have the knee-jerk reaction that "war is bad!!!" the moment we hear it, no matter how justified or humanitarian a particular mission may be. Americans compare everybody to Hitler who is target of their wars, while Germany compares everybody to Hitler who starts a war ... and both is equally wrong most of the time.

Then, we are rather self-righteous many times. We think we are so much more sophisticated and noble than these Americans, who want to let poor people simply rot in their misery. Or the backward hacks in America who want to skip evolution from school curricula. And then, we fail to realize that our fringe nut hacks are much more horrible and even genocidal than the common American fringe nut hack. And that the American system emphasizing individual responsibility and capitalism has many advantages too, and if it's just efficiency.

And we mock American gun crazy people, overlooking that we have a similar love affair with our cars and irresponsible driving.

So in the end ... I guess we're both crazy to some extent.
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If you ever get frustrated or lost let your ethnic brethern help. Always here mein freund.
 
Fletch said:
So European socialists prefer the American candidate that wants to emulate their failed, parasitic ideology. So where is the news here?
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Obviously you weren't listening either. Join turtleguy and discuss your delusions.
 
wolfman24 said:
Obviously you weren't listening either. Join turtleguy and discuss your delusions.
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Listening to what? And what delusions are you referring to?
 
Fletch said:
So European socialists prefer the American candidate that wants to emulate their failed, parasitic ideology. So where is the news here?
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Last time I checked, Germany got a lot of credit from "fiscally responsible" Americans for our austerity policies and our economic strength despite the crisis, and our relatively low debt compared to the US or most of southern Europe.

Now suddenly we are "socialists" and "parasites"? :lol:
 
German guy said:
.. in Germany.

ZEIT-ONLINE-Umfrage: Deutsche beurteilen Obamas Amtszeit positiv | Politik | ZEIT ONLINE

Of course the Germans are not allowed to vote the American President, and most Americans don't care what Europeans think ... but for the sake of curiosity, I thought I'd share this poll with you.

According to the YouGov poll institute, 85% of the Germans would vote for Barack Obama, only 4% for Mitt Romney (11%: Don't know/no comment).

According to this poll, Romney even scored worse than McCain four years ago, who enjoyed the sympathy of 8% of the Germans (compared to 80% for Obama, IIRC).

The YouGov poll also found that 60% of the Germans think Obama's policies in the past four years have been "positive on the bottom line", only 4% believe it was "negative on the bottom line", while 33% say "it was mixed" or "don't know".

I guess that makes Germany an even bluer constituency than Washington DC. ;)
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Germany loves it's fascists...

But like you said - it's moot..
 
German guy said:
Last time I checked, Germany got a lot of credit from "fiscally responsible" Americans for our austerity policies and our economic strength despite the crisis, and our relatively low debt compared to the US or most of southern Europe.

Now suddenly we are "socialists" and "parasites"? :lol:
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Not 'suddenly.' You have been that way for generations. That other socialist nations of europe are economically worse off does not make you germans the beacon of capitalism.
 
It's amazing how most Europeans didn't learn anything from the economic policies of Stalin/Hitler...

70-years later they're back at square one.

Same ideas just a different approach and or tactic...
 
wolfman24 said:
OH what? They voted for Hitler? really. When was the last time you were physically threatened at a voting station. When was the last time someone looked at who you voted for. When was the last time you were harassed to the point that you knew which way the wind was blowing. Thats how many Germans VOTED for Hitler.

Voting in Germany today is more or less democratic and is not public and there is no one harrassing you. Americans need to get over their misinformed love of all things Hitler and learn the truth.

Just because this happened in Germany then does not have anything to do with Germany today.

Its like comparing our treatment of blacks and indians with modern day America.
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It was a joke gomer pile.
 
Fletch said:
Not 'suddenly.' You have been that way for generations. That other socialist nations of europe are economically worse off does not make you germans the beacon of capitalism.
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You think America is beacon of capitalism? In Fraser Economic Freedom index Germany got 7.5 and ended up on 31 out of 144 countries. United States got 7.7 and ended up on 18th place. Not a huge difference. Actually Canada got 8.0 and ended up on 5th place. New Zealand got 8.4 and got 3.

The biggest reason Germans don't support Republicans are their views on issues such as abortion, gay marriage, military intervention, the poor and global warming. Another factor is the Republican failure to implement good policies. It has very little to do with Germany being "socialist."
 
Camlon said:
You think America is beacon of capitalism? In Fraser Economic Freedom index Germany got 7.5 and ended up on 31. United States got 7.7 and ended up on 18th place. Not a huge difference. Actually Canada got 8.0 and ended up on 5th place. New Zealand got 8.4 and got 3.

The biggest reason Germans doesn't support Republicans are their views on issues such as abortion, gay marriage, military intervention, the poor and global warming. Another factor is the Republican failure to implement good policies. It has very little to do with Germany being "socialist."
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how in the great scheme of things does gay marriage or abortion affect the Germans. I guess countries that disarm their citizens can whine about our freedom to own guns. DId you know that friends of mine did not attend a world archery tournament in Australia because they could not bring TARGET CROSSBOWS into the most economical port of entry in that country. Parts of australia have Banned target crossbows (which are used in crime about as much as track and field javelins)
 
Camlon said:
You think America is beacon of capitalism? In Fraser economic freedom index Germany got 7.5 and ended up on 31. United States got 7.7 and ended up on 18th place. Not a huge difference. Actually Canada got 8.0 and ended up on 5th place. New Zealand got 8.4 and got 3.

The biggest reason Germans doesn't support Republicans are their views on issues such as abortion, gay marriage, military intervention, the poor and global warming. Another factor is the Republican failure to implement good policies. It has very little to do with Germany being "socialist."
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And the only solution world leaders generally have to the problems that face the world is socialism and authoritarianism...

You see - what they want is the same thing Hitler gave them 70-years ago... Like all progressives they're fascists...
 
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