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Bayonet Co tells Obama he needs" get educated"

roughdraft274 said:
****, now I'm gonna go get sushi for dinner. Haven't had it in months.
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glad to have helped....

maybe after a good sushi meal you will realize Mitt is the way... Mitt loves sushi...
 
StillBallin75 said:
1) Straw man

2) You do realize you're talking to an individual who has served in the US Navy?
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I think Born Free was being sarcastic bro...I dont think you got the humor.. it was at Obama..
 
Redress said:
Did you know we have 11 carrier strike groups? See, that is why we can be two places at once....

Oh, and 3 more are already in the works, the Ford, Kennedy and one unnamed. New design that should be incredible. Finally, magnetic cats instead of steam ones...
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At any given time, four are in overhaul. Two are usually enroute to relieve one on watch, which leaves five. Minus the Enterprise, that makes four active carriers on watch at any given time.

The surface of the Earth is 70% water.
 
Gonzo Rodeo said:
At any given time, four are in overhaul. Two are usually enroute to relieve one on watch, which leaves five. Minus the Enterprise, that makes four active carriers on watch at any given time.

The surface of the Earth is 70% water.
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How many active carriers were there in 1917?
 
StillBallin75 said:
1) Straw man

2) You do realize you're talking to an individual who has served in the US Navy?
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I was talking to Redress is that you.

So you served in the Navy, I served in the Army, what does that have to do with Obama telling us about his Navy expertise that we have boats that can go under water and we have boats things can land on. I mean who ever knew, that was very educational.

By the way, how did you like Obama calling the Navy "CORPSE-Men"?
 
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AdamT said:
How many active carriers were there in 1917?
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I wonder if Obama could answer that one. I never knew we had boats that could go under water and boats that things could land on. Did you?
 
Born Free said:
I wonder if Obama could answer that one. I never knew we had boats that could go under water and boats that things could land on. Did you?
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you sort of wonder that if someone handed Obama a firearm if he would have any clue which end of it the bullet comes out of
 
AdamT said:
How many active carriers were there in 1917?
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The US had half the world's supply of seaplane tenders during WW I (2/4) by my count, but I am not a naval historian. I could be wrong.

But this intentionally misinterprets and glosses over the point, yet again - the US Navy has a lot of tasking, tasking that they aren't always able to meet, and they continue to be far under the requested number of ships as even more get cut.

Someone can say, "oh, but there's 11 of the damn things out there!", but they don't realize that a) they're not all out to sea at once, b) they take a looooong time to get where they are going, and c) defense-in-depth/redundancy is pretty much close to impossible with such far-flung tasking and ops tempo that our military currently faces.

I'm still shocked that such a non-serious rebuttal to a very important point concerning foreign policy seems to keep so much traction.
 
Gonzo Rodeo said:
At any given time, four are in overhaul. Two are usually enroute to relieve one on watch, which leaves five. Minus the Enterprise, that makes four active carriers on watch at any given time.

The surface of the Earth is 70% water.
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Do you understand the concept of "forward deployed"? 5 carriers(see, you forgot the ones being built, funny that) can be almost anywhere needed in a matter of days. That is the goal and what we want and need.
 
Born Free said:
I was talking to Redress is that you.

So you served in the Navy, I served in the Army, what does that have to do with Obama telling us about his Navy expertise that we have boats that can go under water and we have boats things can land on. I mean who ever knew, that was very educational.

By the way, how did you like Obama calling the Navy "CORPSE-Men"?
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SO did Obama's point go over your head, or are you being intentionally obtuse. You are not going to claim that the role of ships is the same as it was then are you?

And many in the navy say "CORPSE-men", and trying to make something out of that is as stupid as trying to defend Romney's comparison to the navy of 1916/17.
 
TurtleDude said:
you sort of wonder that if someone handed Obama a firearm if he would have any clue which end of it the bullet comes out of
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Dunno. He has shown more knowledge of the military than Romney though, a point you all want to keep evading.
 
Redress said:
Dunno. He has shown more knowledge of the military than Romney though, a point you all want to keep evading.
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Not really. No one on either ticket has ever had any experience in the military and it comes down to who advises them. but Romney's main point is sound, you cannot have an effective foreign policy emanating from a nation that is domestically bankrupt.
 
Redress said:
Dunno. He has shown more knowledge of the military than Romney though, a point you all want to keep evading.
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BTW when you served did you do bayonet training. I am sort of a student of knives and the martial arts surrounding edged weapons and the current M9 bayonet is by far the best one (for use a fighting knife) compared to the older US versions like the M6 and M4 or the stuff that are attached to the end of the AK series of weapons.
 
Born Free said:
I was talking to Redress is that you.

So you served in the Navy, I served in the Army, what does that have to do with Obama telling us about his Navy expertise that we have boats that can go under water and we have boats things can land on. I mean who ever knew, that was very educational.

By the way, how did you like Obama calling the Navy "CORPSE-Men"?
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Thank You for your service Born Free...
 
TurtleDude said:
Not really. No one on either ticket has ever had any experience in the military and it comes down to who advises them. but Romney's main point is sound, you cannot have an effective foreign policy emanating from a nation that is domestically bankrupt.
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Well, you managed to entirely evade the topic now. Well done!
 
TurtleDude said:
BTW when you served did you do bayonet training. I am sort of a student of knives and the martial arts surrounding edged weapons and the current M9 bayonet is by far the best one (for use a fighting knife) compared to the older US versions like the M6 and M4 or the stuff that are attached to the end of the AK series of weapons.
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I fired a clip in the vague general direction of a target through a .22 on a .45 body. That was the extent of training I had on non aircraft mounted weapons.
 
Redress said:
I fired a clip in the vague general direction of a target through a .22 on a .45 body. That was the extent of training I had on non aircraft mounted weapons.
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damn that sucks, I almost joined the Army Marksmanship Unit at Fort Benning. Burl Branham (army coach promised me I would get to shoot a thousand shells a week minimum)

my dad was a navy 20MM gunner-he was a national skeet champion so the navy had him shooting that twin barrel "pom pom" gun-he never saw action though since his brother was KIA Okinawa



I just figured law school was a more useful career option.
 
Redress said:
Do you understand the concept of "forward deployed"? 5 carriers(see, you forgot the ones being built, funny that) can be almost anywhere needed in a matter of days. That is the goal and what we want and need.
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What happens when half of the active carriers are a seven-day steam away from the other half? Iran is posturing in the Straight of Hormuz while China conducts landing craft "exercises" near Taiwan... where do you put the carriers? That's an 8-10 day cruise between those two areas. Do you have two 2-carrier groups for mutual support, or do you break them up? Leave one on the way in the Indian Ocean to discourage the Tamils from committing genocide while you're busy elsewhere? Or take that one a little further down to Indonesia to provide a quick-response presence against active AQ cells in the region? How many carriers do you leave in the Mediterranean to cover Libya, Syria, Egypt, sub-Saharan Africa, etc?

A matter of days is sometimes a matter of a regional conflict breaking out. If you said we had 30 carriers, I'd still say we didn't have enough.
 
Gonzo Rodeo said:
What happens when half of the active carriers are a seven-day steam away from the other half? Iran is posturing in the Straight of Hormuz while China conducts landing craft "exercises" near Taiwan... where do you put the carriers? That's an 8-10 day cruise between those two areas. Do you have two 2-carrier groups for mutual support, or do you break them up? Leave one on the way in the Indian Ocean to discourage the Tamils from committing genocide while you're busy elsewhere? Or take that one a little further down to Indonesia to provide a quick-response presence against active AQ cells in the region? How many carriers do you leave in the Mediterranean to cover Libya, Syria, Egypt, sub-Saharan Africa, etc?

A matter of days is sometimes a matter of a regional conflict breaking out. If you said we had 30 carriers, I'd still say we didn't have enough.
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A carrier being a 7 day steam away from the rest of the deployed carriers is fairly normal.

Iran has been posturing in the Straits of Hormuz but cannot close it. 1 carrier could easily keep it open. 1 carrier is more than a match for the Chinese navy and we have other forces in the area which can reach Taiwan. Note that carriers are positioned to respond, not to strike, with the exception of when we have a direct immediate threat. You have shown no need for more than 10 Carrier strike groups.
 
Redress said:
A carrier being a 7 day steam away from the rest of the deployed carriers is fairly normal.

Iran has been posturing in the Straits of Hormuz but cannot close it. 1 carrier could easily keep it open. 1 carrier is more than a match for the Chinese navy and we have other forces in the area which can reach Taiwan. Note that carriers are positioned to respond, not to strike, with the exception of when we have a direct immediate threat. You have shown no need for more than 10 Carrier strike groups.
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In "peace time" conditions, I agree with you. But that's where that whole defense-in-depth thing comes in. A first-strike attack can cripple a carrier, and then you have a 98,000 ton displacement metal can in the water that cannot even conduct flight operations. Our ASW screens are good, but they are not godly. All it takes is one sub, or one volley of vampires (if they are lucky) and that carrier is down for the count.

Now, there is no way anyone is going to get the drop on a carrier that is fully tuned up and in battle stations. No way. But a sucker punch can effectively knock out the baddest of the bad if delivered with no warning. Multiple carriers reduces this risk, as well as doubles the air power envelope. Sure, a single carrier group can take on the entire Chinese navy... but not the Chinese air force. Also, a single carrier air wing has an operational radius of about 300 nm. If you place another carrier at the outside of that envelope, you can have a 600 nm airpower envelope, double-protecting the entire task force.

Just like in the world of racing, "there is no replacement for displacement."
 
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