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Alan Ashton: Mitt Romney's Rev. Wright???

OpportunityCost said:
In what ****ing world exactly do the media investigate any significant portion of Obama's life? Cause it sure aint this one.

Rest of your post is tin foil hat fodder.
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Relax.
Now, I know you don't expect me to believe that the far right isn't represented in the media. I know that the far right has spent a lot of time investigating Obama so they can get anything that makes Obama look bad out to the right wing media groups. The media has it's factions and one of the is far right. SOme examples, Fox News, Rush, Beck, the 700 club. Thats just a few.
 
I should mention that to mislabel donations for other purpose is more than a bad moment for a campaign. It is a major felony with years of incarceration. I've seen greedy people get caught and they are all doing at least a decade in a federal facility, not so bad but definitely not fun.

So, if that's what you believe, there shouldn't be any concern about Romney. He'll be in handcuffs. The 3 year audit limit does not apply to fraud.

Hope I didn't burst your bubble:lol:



CONSagainROMNEY said:
He is not inthe same league in terms of his importance in the wedge issues they excite (racism and same sex marriage). But in terms of being a potential problem for Romney, Ashton could even be bigger than Wright. The reason is because of Romney's taxes. If it turns out that Romney have large sums of money to Ashton's anti-same sex marriage group under the guise of "tithings" or "charitable donations" and that money was actually used for a political activist group, then that could spell huge trouble for ROmney if that came out before the election.
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So.... CONSagainstROMNEY... I assume your name is short for "Conservatives Against Romney"....

... where exactly are you "conservative"? I can't recall seeing you embrace or support any particular conservative policy position up to this point. Offhand all I've seen you do is bash Mittens. Granted, he's pretty bashable, but I'm starting to wonder if the CON part of your name is actually ... errum.... legitimate.
 
OpportunityCost said:
On the same note, do we treat Pelosi and Biden differently? They are catholics are they not? Or do they just get a pass?
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It seems to me that this thread was started as a very clumsy, ignorant attempt to condemn Mr. Romney for being more or less true to the doctrines and practices of his professed religion. More specifically, as Mormonism is very much opposed to the concept of “same sex marriage”, it is being presumed that Mr. Romney is as well, and that as a political leader, he will tend to favor policies that are consistent with this position.

So what, then, are we to make of Mr. Biden and Ms. Pelosi, as Catholics? The Catholic church takes the same position that the Mormon church does on this issue. What are Biden's and Pelosi's policy positions on this issue? We might as well also mention their support for murdering unborn children, and for forcing employers to pay for contraceptives, both of which the Catholic church holds to be highly immoral.

So what is the greater evil—pursuing policies that are consistent with one's professed religion, as it seems to be greatly feared that Romney will do, or pursuing policies that, according to one's professed religion, are evil and immoral, as Biden and Pelosi openly do? Which is more consistent with someone of good moral character and integrity?

If anything this thread gives us reason to support Romney, rather than oppose him, I think.
 
CONSagainROMNEY said:
If it turns out that Romney have large sums of money to Ashton's anti-same sex marriage group under the guise of "tithings" or "charitable donations" and that money was actually used for a political activist group, then that could spell huge trouble for ROmney if that came out before the election.
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As a Mormon, Romney wouldn't have been paying “tithing” to anyone or anything other than the church.

As for charitable or political contributions to any other organization, that is certainly within his rights to do so.

If you're going to claim that Romney committed some kind of tax fraud, by making donations of one sort, and claiming them on his taxes as another sort, for the purpose of evading taxes, then the burden is on you to prove it, and not on him or anyone else to disprove it. If you've provided anything that comes anywhere close to constituting credible evidence of any such fraud, then I have somehow failed to notice it.

I think your real problem is that you are putting the shiny side inward. Try putting it outward instead; it works better that way.
 
Goshin said:
So.... CONSagainstROMNEY... I assume your name is short for "Conservatives Against Romney"....
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That's what I initially assumed as well. I think it's becoming apparent that that's not what it means. Based on his postings so far “con-artist” seems to fit much better than “conservative”, don't you think?
 
Bob Blaylock said:
I'm not going to watch the video. If there is anything in it that is at all relevant to whatever point you are trying to make, I suggest you describe it in your own words.

As far as I can tell, there's nothing to see here.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is opposed to “gay marriage”, and has supported efforts to protect genuine marriage.

This Alan Ashton is apparently a member of this church, and apparently agrees with this position, and has donated some of his own resources to this cause. So what?

You haven't explained what he has to do with Mitt Romney, other than being a member of the same religion, and a vague presumption that Romney agrees with the church, with Mr. Ashton, and with the vast majority of Americans regarding this matter.

Unless you can demonstrate otherwise, there's nothing to see here; move along.
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I have to agree with you on this one Bob...Id have to see more before I make any connection to romny.
I have to agree with you on this one
 
Bob Blaylock said:
As a Mormon, Romney wouldn't have been paying “tithing” to anyone or anything other than the church.

As for charitable or political contributions to any other organization, that is certainly within his rights to do so.

If you're going to claim that Romney committed some kind of tax fraud, by making donations of one sort, and claiming them on his taxes as another sort, for the purpose of evading taxes, then the burden is on you to prove it, and not on him or anyone else to disprove it. If you've provided anything that comes anywhere close to constituting credible evidence of any such fraud, then I have somehow failed to notice it.

I think your real problem is that you are putting the shiny side inward. Try putting it outward instead; it works better that way.
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The evidence is all circumstancial at this point - I think I mentioned that before. But sometimes connecting the dots create an accurate picture.
We know that Romney is refusing to release his taxes like every other major party nominee for POTUS has done since his own father called for it back in '68
We know that Harry Ried (a Mormon) who has contacts with John Huntsman Sr (a mormon) have made statements that something fishy is going on with Mitt's taxes
We know that Mitt met with Ashton and the Morman church before running for Governor to discuss his stance on SSM.
We know that it was decided that ROmney would not get elected Gov of Mass if he came out against SSM
We know that shortly afterward the Mormon church issued verbage that denounced SSM that was to be read at church meetings
We know that the Mormon church through Ashton bankrolled an anti-SSM group to fight Propisition 8 in California
We know that if it were found out that Romney donated to that group it would hurt him politically (Now more than ever with this Todd Akin ordeal)
We know that ROmney is a flip flopper.
 
CONSagainROMNEY said:
The evidence is all circumstancial at this point - I think I mentioned that before. But sometimes connecting the dots create an accurate picture.
We know that Romney is refusing to release his taxes like every other major party nominee for POTUS has done since his own father called for it back in '68
We know that Harry Ried (a Mormon) who has contacts with John Huntsman Sr (a mormon) have made statements that something fishy is going on with Mitt's taxes
We know that Mitt met with Ashton and the Morman church before running for Governor to discuss his stance on SSM.
We know that it was decided that ROmney would not get elected Gov of Mass if he came out against SSM
We know that shortly afterward the Mormon church issued verbage that denounced SSM that was to be read at church meetings
We know that the Mormon church through Ashton bankrolled an anti-SSM group to fight Propisition 8 in California
We know that if it were found out that Romney donated to that group it would hurt him politically (Now more than ever with this Todd Akin ordeal)
We know that ROmney is a flip flopper.
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You're claiming that “We know…” a lot of things that no, we don't know.

“We” don't “know” anything just on the basis of you making them up and claiming them.
 
CONSagainROMNEY said:
We know that Mitt met with Ashton and the Morman church before running for Governor to discuss his stance on SSM.
We know that it was decided that ROmney would not get elected Gov of Mass if he came out against SSM
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And how do we “know” of this meeting, and what was decided therein? Were records of this meting made public? If not, how would you know that it took place, or what was discussed, or what conclusions were reached? It's worth pointing out, I think, that “the church” wouldn't attend such a meeting. “The church” is an organization consisting, as of the last count I've heard, of over thirteen million individuals. Perhaps you mean to claim that some specific individuals holding positions within the church attended this meeting, but for such a claim to have even the faintest vestige of worth, you'd need to be able to identify which specific individuals these were, what positions they held in the church, and how much authority they allegedly exercised on behalf of the church.


CONSagainROMNEY said:
We know that the Mormon church through Ashton bankrolled an anti-SSM group to fight Propisition 8 in California
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As far as I can find any account, Mr. Ashton contributed a fair amount of his own money to that cause; I haven't found any evidence that he took donations from others to apply to this cause. The church used some of its own resources to support this cause as well. You haven't provided any reason to suppose that any of the church's resources went through Mr. Ashton, nor that even if they did, that this would constitute anything illegal or unethical, nor that it would have anything to do with Mr. Romney.

CONSagainROMNEY said:
We know that if it were found out that Romney donated to that group it would hurt him politically (Now more than ever with this Todd Akin ordeal)
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I don't see why. As it happens, the vast majority of Americans agree with the position that you are assuming that Mr. Romney holds regarding “same sex marriage”. How does it hurt him for it to be known that he has donated some of his own money to support that position? And what does any of this have to do with Mr. Akin?
 
Bob Blaylock said:
You're claiming that “We know…” a lot of things that no, we don't know.

“We” don't “know” anything just on the basis of you making them up and claiming them.
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Specifically which point are you saying that we do not know?

Also, now even if I provide proof of all these things that "we know" that doesnt automatically prove Romney guilty. But I like to think that most folks arent so naive to deny that if walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and smells like a duck...then its probablly a duck. Correct?
 
Lets see...wasnt that one guy...what was his name...Barrack something...wasnt HE also opposed to gay marriage? Doesnt he still believe it is wrong and against God? Isnt there still a fair number of democrats that believe the same thing and didnt a recent group of black ministers...former Obama supporters...recently come out against Obamas political switcheroo?

"Cons"

Con

:lamo
 
MaggieD said:
I give you credit for an information-filled post that took some time to put together, so I'll not simply dismiss it out of hand.

I'm sorry, but it doesn't bother me one little iota that Romney is a Mormon. Nor does it bother me that he is devout in his faith.
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Don't get me wrong, his faith does not bother me much more than any other christian fundamentalist in the government. I would also be lying if i said the mormon religion and it's attempts to get into the government bothered me as much as the presence of christian fascism in our government. It is a part of the same thing i tell people when they try to claim scientology is going to infiltrate the government. very simply the powerful christian control of our government would never allow it on a large scale. However, for those devout christians who faith matters to it should matter who Romney is as a mormon. I have heard time and time again that acceptance of homosexuality cannot be tolerated because it leads to polygamy. Well, this is a group who actually would like to see the restrictions on a single spouse eliminated from the limits on marriage. If things like that matter to you then Romney is a bigger problem than any other candidate. If not then all of this is merely an educational post regarding mitt romney and his history with the church of LDS.

I do find it odd that it seems to be an issue with many republicans that obama was with wright. If their opinion of dangerous religious fundamental forces undermining the dangerous religious fundamental forces we have in place is an issue then certainly a cult that has branched away from the christian faith and has forsaken jesus should be a concern. Yeah, wright is bad, but I can see where his anger comes from. being a part of the civil rights movement and seeing the promise of real equality fade to a mix of in your face racism and behind your back racism i can understand how he might feel America has failed him and be bothered that the American dream is withheld from him by 'the man." As with any group of religious radicals that fires up their followers with hate, i see a potential for some to take it to the point of violence. In the end Obama dropped him like a hot potato something that mitt has failed to do with his supporters at the mormon church.
MaggieD said:
I'm not going to fact check your post. But even if what you say about Romney and the Mormon Church is 100% correct? That "awfulness" you see pales in comparison to Barack Obama & Family sitting in church for twenty freakin' years listening to Rev. Wright spiel his hate-filled racially divisive sermons. Obama only distanced himself from Rev. Wright when it became politically necessary.
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So is it worse to s[pend 20 years sitting in a pew listening to the crap and treat your preacher like most americans, or is it worse to have been a part of the illegal acts of the church and used it to dodge the draft and avoid serving your country when in need? Obama seems like most people. They go through the motions of church, but they have real life to deal with. Obama did not run his church, nor does he act as a missionary for it. yes, when it interfered with his presidency he dropped that church quickly showing he really doesn't seem to carry the same animosity and hate wright does. I just see boring yourself in a pew for a few hours a week and then going on with your life without following the insanity of the religion to be fairly normal. OTOH getting yourself involved in a cult and going to far as to completely ignore your own brother because he dropped out of the faith to be a big sign someone believes a lot too much in the cult they are involved in. FYI Mitt has disowned his own brother for having the nerve to chose another faith. For a guy who says family is important he sure picked a stupid reason to toss his brother out like trash. That is a behavior that is seen very often in demanding and dangerous cult followers and leaders. If he can toss his own brother aside for his cult, then what is he going to do to the rest of us?
MaggieD said:
I'm really beginning this election is going to be more of a horse race than I at first expected. Obama supporters are getting pretty desperate, in my opinion.
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I hear that a lot, but i don't see either candidate running away with this campaign. If the situation was as dire as you say we certainly would not see many polls showing obama to have a good lead in the delegate race. can mitt catch up? it is theoretically possible, but I do not see him running away with the election, nor making great strides that should make obama feel like he is destined to lose. If you want to consider bringing up failures in your opponent to be a sign of desperation you don't know much about every election in the US. It is pretty standard, and by your own logic mitt is also desperate because we see a lot of the same behavior by him.
 
Hairytic said:
That's the heart of this whole topic. If Romney, who we know is a leader within the Mormon church, funds the church's political agnda's, the people should know this before the election. Romney wants most of his life hidden from the people. I am so tired of hearing him say, "You will just have to trust me". No, I don't have to trust him. He has not been proven trust worthy. Like you said, Obama went to a church and his reverand made some outlandish statements. That is a far cry from funding a religious political agenda.
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it is also a far cry from operating as a representative for your church and it's goals. I would also say it is way out there for Mitt to disown his own brother for walking away from the LDS church. That last point is something you see from people who are way too into their religion, and put it above family and everything else.

To go a little further one thing that is noticeable in many cult members is the inability to connect with regular society. this stems from surrounding yourself with people who are in your cult and very few others. I would imagine that both his participation in the LDS cult at high levels, and his wealth have separated him so much from other people he really has a very hard time understanding them. This is probably why he makes so many comments that are off and get him into trouble.
 
We know that Romney is refusing to release his taxes like every other major party nominee for POTUS has done since his own father called for it back in '68
We know that Harry Ried (a Mormon) who has contacts with John Huntsman Sr (a mormon) have made statements that something fishy is going on with Mitt's taxes
We know that Mitt met with Ashton and the Morman church before running for Governor to discuss his stance on SSM.
We know that it was decided that ROmney would not get elected Gov of Mass if he came out against SSM
We know that shortly afterward the Mormon church issued verbage that denounced SSM that was to be read at church meetings
We know that the Mormon church through Ashton bankrolled an anti-SSM group to fight Propisition 8 in California
We know that if it were found out that Romney donated to that group it would hurt him politically (Now more than ever with this Todd Akin ordeal)
We know that ROmney is a flip flopper.
Click to expand...

1. Hes released one year. Hes refusing to give Dems opposition research to twist, much as you are doing in this thread.
2. Huntsman has not said anything about Romney's taxes---Harry Reid has. Reid has political advantage in what hes doing so you'll have to pardon for calling BS.
3. We dont know that. It didnt happen that way so we dont "know" it.
4. Hmm prop 8 was occurring at much the same time. Current events shaping sermons....whoda thunk it?
5. Show me where LDS funds went to Ashton who used them for political purpose----you havent done that yet.
6. Political donations regarding prop 8 were all made public. If Romney did donate, it would be there.
7. Toss in an appellation that has nothing to do with your argument at the end just to be more trollish.

Worthless thread, capped off with more worthless post. Better post something more than innuendo, bull**** and supposition if you want to prove something. This isnt DU, we prefer substance over political red meat with no basis in fact.
 
OpportunityCost said:
1. Hes released one year. Hes refusing to give Dems opposition research to twist, much as you are doing in this thread.
2. Huntsman has not said anything about Romney's taxes---Harry Reid has. Reid has political advantage in what hes doing so you'll have to pardon for calling BS.
3. We dont know that. It didnt happen that way so we dont "know" it.
4. Hmm prop 8 was occurring at much the same time. Current events shaping sermons....whoda thunk it?
5. Show me where LDS funds went to Ashton who used them for political purpose----you havent done that yet.
6. Political donations regarding prop 8 were all made public. If Romney did donate, it would be there.
7. Toss in an appellation that has nothing to do with your argument at the end just to be more trollish.

Worthless thread, capped off with more worthless post. Better post something more than innuendo, bull**** and supposition if you want to prove something. This isnt DU, we prefer substance over political red meat with no basis in fact.
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If Romney doesn't want his taxes to be scrutinized? Then he should be running for office.
 
Goshin said:
So.... CONSagainstROMNEY... I assume your name is short for "Conservatives Against Romney"....

... where exactly are you "conservative"? I can't recall seeing you embrace or support any particular conservative policy position up to this point. Offhand all I've seen you do is bash Mittens. Granted, he's pretty bashable, but I'm starting to wonder if the CON part of your name is actually ... errum.... legitimate.
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And the crickets sing....


Chirp...

Chrip...

Chrip...


:wassat1:
 
CONSagainROMNEY said:
Harry Reid had no poltical advantage in coming out agains Romney. It was a huge risk. The downside is so huge in fact that it seemed redonkulas to think he would make such claims if they were not true.

Dishonor Roll » Rights Equal Rights
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The Priesthood | Mormons in Business

Goshin said:
And the crickets sing....


Chirp...

Chrip...

Chrip...


:wassat1:
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I'm a fiscal conservative. If you dont know what it means to be a fiscal conservative, then just look it up and that will describe why I am a Conservative.
 
I'm not worried about all the money. I just want to know if the Space Human Alien that the Mormons call god will speak at the convention?
 
Goshin said:
If you say so bud. It's just that I have yet to hear you stand on a conservative policy position of any kind... seems a bit suspicious.
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Did you look up the definition of Fiscal Conservative?
If so, then look up Romney's record as Gov. of Mass and tell me if you think he is actually a Conservative.
 
CONSagainROMNEY said:
Did you look up the definition of Fiscal Conservative?
If so, then look up Romney's record as Gov. of Mass and tell me if you think he is actually a Conservative.
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Can't recall that I've ever said Mittens was a conservative. My question was why you seem to spend all your time on Mittens but, as far as I've seen, I don't think you've ever on this forum argued a conservative position on anything, aside from talking about Romney, fiscal or otherwise...
 
Goshin said:
Can't recall that I've ever said Mittens was a conservative. My question was why you seem to spend all your time on Mittens but, as far as I've seen, I don't think you've ever on this forum argued a conservative position on anything, aside from talking about Romney, fiscal or otherwise...
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You obviously havnt read all of my posts.
And since this is a forum on the 2012 POTUS election, it only makes sense that I would spend a good deal of my time dealing with Mitt, wouldnt it?
 
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