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Chicago defies forgotten 2nd Amendment

jamesrage

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Amazing how anyone can support such blatant anti-2nd amendment laws and claim to support constitutional rights.

Chicago defies forgotten 2nd Amendment -- chicagotribune.com

Since the Supreme Court upheld the individual right to own guns last summer, one municipality with handgun bans after another has faced reality. Washington, which lost the case, changed its law. Morton Grove repealed its ban. So did Wilmette. Likewise for Evanston. Last week, Winnetka followed suit.

Then there is Chicago, which is being sued for violating the 2nd Amendment but refuses to confront the possibility that what the Supreme Court said may apply to this side of the Appalachians.

When it comes to firearms, Mayor Richard Daley is no slave to rationality. "Does this lead to everyone having a gun in our society?" he asked after the ruling came down. "Then why don't we do away with the court system and go back to the Old West, where you have a gun and I have a gun and we'll settle it in the streets?"

From listening to him, you might assume that the only places in North America that don't have firefights on a daily basis are cities that outlaw handguns. You might also assume that Chicago is an oasis of concord, rather than the site of 443 homicides last year.

So it's no surprise that Daley refuses to make the slightest change to the handgun ordinance, preferring to fight the lawsuits filed by the National Rifle Association. He is not impressed that 1) the law almost certainly violates the Constitution, which elected officials are supposed to uphold, and 2) it would cost taxpayers a lot of money to fight lawsuits the city is bound to lose.

The Chicago ban dates back to 1983, when no one had to worry about the forgotten 2nd Amendment. The ordinance prohibited the possession of all handguns (except those acquired before the law took effect).

It had no obvious benefits: Homicides climbed in the ensuing years and by 1992 were 41 percent higher than before. But the policy rested undisturbed until last summer, when the Supreme Court ruled that Washington's ban on handguns violated the individual right to use arms for self-defense in the home.

If that logic applies to the Washington statute, it very likely applies to Chicago's law. The city, however, notes that the nation's capital is a federal enclave, and that the court did not say states must respect the 2nd Amendment. That's true. The court's ruling also did not say that China is in Asia, which doesn't make it part of South America.

Once upon a time, the Bill of Rights restricted only what the federal government could do: States were free to restrict free speech, conduct unreasonable searches and impose cruel and unusual punishments. But nowadays the court says that because of the 14th Amendment, adopted after the Civil War, states must respect virtually all the rights set out in the Constitution.
 
Well, I know I'd certainly love being a resident of Chicago and having my taxes go to the mayor having a tissy fit and refusing to acknowledge the highest court in the land

:roll:

People have forgotten all to much that they're public SERVENTS
 
Well, I know I'd certainly love being a resident of Chicago and having my taxes go to the mayor having a tissy fit and refusing to acknowledge the highest court in the land

:roll:

People have forgotten all to much that they're public SERVENTS

Daley is a ****ing tyrant. If it wasn't for the Bears and my family, I'd be out of here.
 
Just one thing I wanted to mention. The OP is making the argument that banning guns doesn't deter gun violence, so you can't use that as an argument. Well, the same could be said for the war on drugs. People everywhere make the conscious choice to deal in illegal narcotics all the time and to harm their own bodies. I make no claim over whether or not the drug laws need to be tossed out, but the laws exist on the basis of a moral principle. I know drugs aren't a second amendment issue either, but that's not the point I'm trying to make.

Making guns illegal might not stop the gun violence but it still creates the message that society is not okay with it. That would be the point.

I agree with restricting the use on some types of gun while allowing others. The second amendment doesn't say you're entitled to all kinds of firearms, so if the Mayor is smart, he will simply make rules about what type of gun are permissible. Ban the kinds that can be concealed.
 
Orius wrote.
Quote
(so if the Mayor is smart, he will simply make rules about what type of gun are permissible. Ban the kinds that can be concealed.)

Now if this Mayor is REALLY SMART, he will permit Potato guns and Water Pistols BUT place a blanket ban on all other firearm weapons.
 
Now if this Mayor is REALLY SMART, he will permit Potato guns and Water Pistols BUT place a blanket ban on all other firearm weapons.

When I was younger I made a potato Gun out fo PVC piping and using WD-40 as a propellant. Then I put 1/2 a potato in it, a bunch of bb's and another 1/2 potato.

That thing would blast holes in ****.
 
Amazing how anyone can support such blatant anti-2nd amendment laws and claim to support constitutional rights.

Chicago defies forgotten 2nd Amendment -- chicagotribune.com

Since the Supreme Court upheld the individual right to own guns last summer, one municipality with handgun bans after another has faced reality. Washington, which lost the case, changed its law. Morton Grove repealed its ban. So did Wilmette. Likewise for Evanston. Last week, Winnetka followed suit.

Then there is Chicago, which is being sued for violating the 2nd Amendment but refuses to confront the possibility that what the Supreme Court said may apply to this side of the Appalachians.

When it comes to firearms, Mayor Richard Daley is no slave to rationality. "Does this lead to everyone having a gun in our society?" he asked after the ruling came down. "Then why don't we do away with the court system and go back to the Old West, where you have a gun and I have a gun and we'll settle it in the streets?"

From listening to him, you might assume that the only places in North America that don't have firefights on a daily basis are cities that outlaw handguns. You might also assume that Chicago is an oasis of concord, rather than the site of 443 homicides last year.

So it's no surprise that Daley refuses to make the slightest change to the handgun ordinance, preferring to fight the lawsuits filed by the National Rifle Association. He is not impressed that 1) the law almost certainly violates the Constitution, which elected officials are supposed to uphold, and 2) it would cost taxpayers a lot of money to fight lawsuits the city is bound to lose.

The Chicago ban dates back to 1983, when no one had to worry about the forgotten 2nd Amendment. The ordinance prohibited the possession of all handguns (except those acquired before the law took effect).

It had no obvious benefits: Homicides climbed in the ensuing years and by 1992 were 41 percent higher than before. But the policy rested undisturbed until last summer, when the Supreme Court ruled that Washington's ban on handguns violated the individual right to use arms for self-defense in the home.

If that logic applies to the Washington statute, it very likely applies to Chicago's law. The city, however, notes that the nation's capital is a federal enclave, and that the court did not say states must respect the 2nd Amendment. That's true. The court's ruling also did not say that China is in Asia, which doesn't make it part of South America.

Once upon a time, the Bill of Rights restricted only what the federal government could do: States were free to restrict free speech, conduct unreasonable searches and impose cruel and unusual punishments. But nowadays the court says that because of the 14th Amendment, adopted after the Civil War, states must respect virtually all the rights set out in the Constitution.

In my opinion, Mayor Daley is the poster child for Liberal Democrat politics.

Look at Daley's actions, closing down Meigs Field is one example, and that pretty much defines the Democrat Party IMHO.
 
I agree with restricting the use on some types of gun while allowing others. The second amendment doesn't say you're entitled to all kinds of firearms, so if the Mayor is smart, he will simply make rules about what type of gun are permissible. Ban the kinds that can be concealed.

Those laws already exist; no one needs to make new ones. You cannot own selective fire assault weapons or automatic machine guns.

You already have to register your weapons and go through a waiting period and background check. You cannot carry a concealed weapon unless you get a license.

There are already plenty of laws on the books; more than enough. What the debate here is, is do Americans have the RIGHT to protect themselves from thugs and do Americans have the RIGHT to hunt or use guns for their recreation; the OBVIOUS answer is yes.

Mayor Daley represents a Liberal mentality in this country that if THEY don't like it, THEY will make up their own rules and regulations the rest of the country and Constitution be damned.

Mayor Daley also represents the false Liberal belief that if we take away guns, law breaking criminals will no longer use them to commit crimes. Frankly, with the gross level of incompetence Government represent, the notion that I will rely on them from preventing a thug from breaking into my home and beating me senseless is not that great.

It's too late to ask Anne Presley what she thinks about protecting yourself from thugs.
 
Those laws already exist; no one needs to make new ones. You cannot own selective fire assault weapons or automatic machine guns.

You already have to register your weapons and go through a waiting period and background check. You cannot carry a concealed weapon unless you get a license.

There are already plenty of laws on the books; more than enough.

Laws which are already thoroughly unconstitutional, and violations of the principle that a free man may go armed if he so chooses; as a citizen, his arms are an extension of the lawful defense of his community.

I am tired of hearing so-called "gun rights" advocates defending these immoral laws, as if they are any less illegal and unacceptable than the new laws that they are fighting against.
 
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I'm generally pretty liberal in my politics, but I have never understood the idea of gun control, unless it's going to be absolute (i.e. get rid of all guns all over the world, so that not even police or militaries have them--they just no longer exist at all). You can't let any group attain greater power to cause harm than any other, and not expect the more powerful group to use it to the detriment of the less powerful, and this includes the government. Anyone with any grasp of history I just can't see being in support of gun control.
 
Laws which are already thoroughly unconstitutional, and violations of the principle that a free man may go armed if he so chooses-- as a citizen, his arms are an extension of the lawful defense of his community.

I am tired of hearing so-called "gun rights" advocates defending these immoral laws-- as if they are any less illegal and unacceptable than the new laws that they are fighting against.

I don't know if you are using satire, or are serious. You are more extreme than I am; I understand the purpose of keeping hand grenades, automatic weapons, plastic explosives and bazookas out of the hands of the average person; after all, even highly trained military men and women have accidents with such dangerous weapons.

I do believe there have to be certain limitations to those Constitutional rights. Are you a member of NRA? Do you realize they are the ONLY organization that constantly fights against these 2nd amendment intrusions. If you are not a member, I recommend buying a membership if only to keep them funded to protect your rights; they are the ONLY organization doing so.

:2wave:
 
Those laws already exist; no one needs to make new ones. You cannot own selective fire assault weapons or automatic machine guns.

Actually with the right permits you can own those weapons.

You already have to register your weapons and go through a waiting period and background check.
Actually most states are against such unconstitutional laws.

17 states requiring waiting periods that can be anywhere from 48 hours to 6 months to purchase the firearm or to get the permit to just to get the handgun.13 states require permits/licenses. Nine states require fire arm registrations.Out of the 17 states that have a waiting period, 5 do not require a permit/licesne and registration.

California
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE

Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

California - State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a "handgun safety certificate" (like a license) prior to purchasing a handgun. The handgun buyer must pass a written safety test and a hands-on safety demonstration and provide fingerprints and proof of residency. The certificate is also required for anyone who wishes to be "loaned" a handgun outside of the presence of the owner.

snip..

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? Partial

California - State law only requires registration of assault weapons. No state requirement that other firearms be registered.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD

Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

California - State law requires a 10-day waiting period for all gun sales. This 10-day period is used by law enforcement to run a criminal background check to make sure the gun buyer is not prohibited from acquiring firearms. The 10-days also serves as a "cooling off" period to help prevent crimes of passion

Connecticut
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

Connecticut - State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a license prior to purchasing a handgun. The handgun buyer must pass a safety course safety test and provide fingerprints. The license is also generally required for anyone who wishes to be "loaned" a handgun outside of the presence of the owner. Also see: Safety Training.

snip..

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? Partial

Connecticut - State law only requires registration of assault weapons.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Partial

Connecticut - State law requires all handgun buyers to first obtain a pistol permit or eligibility certificate, which can take up to 90 days.

There is a 14-day waiting period and background check for buyers of rifles and shotguns, but only if purchased from a licensed gun dealer, and only unless the buyer does not have a pistol permit, eligibility certificate, or hunting license.

Florida
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires a 3-day waiting period for all handgun sales by licensed dealers. Counties may extend the waiting period to 5-days and apply it to long guns and sales by non-licensed dealers at gun shows and flea markets.


Hawaii
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a license prior to purchasing a handgun. The handgun buyer must pass a written safety test and a hands-on demonstration including firing the handgun and provide fingerprints. The license is also generally required for anyone who wishes to be "loaned" a handgun outside of the presence of the owner. Also see: Safety Training.

snip..

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? Partial

Hawaii - State law requires gun owners to register any firearm they obtain, but this only applied to guns obtained after the law was enacted.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

Hawaii - State law requires a 14 to 20-day waiting period to obtain a license to purchase any handgun.


Illinois
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

Illinois: State law requires gun buyers to obtain a license (FOID card) prior to purchasing a firearm. The FOID card is also required of anyone owning a firearm.

snip..

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? Partial

Illinois: While there is no state requirement that gun owners register specific firearms, it is generally illegal to possess a firearm without a license

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires a 72-hour waiting period for all handgun sales and a 24-hour waiting period on all long gun sales. The waiting period is used by law enforcement to run a criminal background check to make sure the handgun buyer is not prohibited from acquiring firearms. In addition, state law requires gun buyers to obtain a Firearm Owner's Identification Card (FOID), before purchasing a firearm. Law enforcement may take up to 30 days to complete a background check on FOID Card applicants.


Iowa
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a permit from local law enforcement prior to purchasing a handgun.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires a 3-day waiting period for all handgun sales.


Maryland
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a permit-to-purchase from law enforcement prior to purchasing a handgun or assault weapon.

snip...

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? Partial

State law only requires registration of assault weapons.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

Maryland: State law requires a 7-day waiting period for all handgun or assault weapon sales.


Massachusetts
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

State law requires anyone buying or owning a firearm to obtain a license from law enforcement. Handgun buyers must take a safety course and provide fingerprints. The license is also required for anyone who wishes to be "loaned" a handgun outside of the presence of the owner. The permit process allows law enforcement 40 days to do a more complete background check.

snip..

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? Partial


Massachusetts: While there is no state requirement that gun owners register specific firearms, it is generally illegal to possess a firearm without a license.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD

Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires handgun purchasers to first obtain a permit from law enforcement, which can take up to 40-days.

Michigan
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes


State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a permit from local law enforcement prior to purchasing a handgun. But selling a handgun to someone without a permit is only a simple misdemeanor, which undermines the law and makes it easy to ignore. To obtain the permit, handgun buyers must correctly answer 70% of the questions on a written safety test, but the wrong answers are pointed out and they are allowed to retake the test if they fail. Fingerprints are required to obtain a permit to purchase. CCW permit holders are exempt from having to obtain a handgun purchase permit.

snip..

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? Partial

Michigan: State law requires anyone owning a handgun who lives in an area with a police department to present the handgun to local police and a record is sent to state police, but failure to comply is just a $50 fine.


Minnesota
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

Minnesota: State law requires a 7-day waiting period for all handgun or assault weapon sales by federally licensed dealers unless the buyer has a state permit (which takes 7 days)

Nebraska
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes


State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a handgun certificate from law enforcement prior to purchasing a handgun. The permit only involves a background check - no safety training or fingerprints are required. Law enforcement may take up to 3 days for the background check on the permit applicant. The permit is valid for three years.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires a 2-day waiting period for all handgun sales.

continued in next post.
 
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Continued from above post.


New Jersey
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a license from law enforcement prior to purchasing a handgun and long gun buyers must have a firearms identification card. The license only involves background checks and fingerprinting, no safety training is required. The license is also generally required for anyone who wishes to be "loaned" a handgun outside of the presence of the owner. The license is valid for up to 90 days, and may be renewed for an additional 90 days. The fees are $49 for fingerprinting, $2 for a handgun permit and $5 for an identification card. The permit is normally processed in less than one month, or less than six months if additional research is needed. While only handguns require a handgun permit, a firearms identification card is required to receive a long gun and that card is valid until/unless revoked.

snip..

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? Partial

State law only requires registration of assault weapons.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires handgun buyers to first obtain a permit to purchase from law enforcement. Law enforcement normally processes the application in less than 30-days.

New York
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

New York: State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a license from law enforcement prior to purchasing their first handgun - this is a license to "possess" not just to purchase. Applicants must be 21. The license only involves a background check and fingerprinting, no safety training is required. The license is also generally required to be "loaned" a handgun outside of the presence of the owner. License applications may take up to six months. The license is generally good until revoked, except in New York City, Nassau/Suffolk/Westchester counties which have fixed license period. License fees vary but are at least $74, the cost of fingerprint processing.

snip..

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? Partial

State law requires anyone owning a handgun to obtain a license listing each handgun owned.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires up to 6-months to obtain a license to purchase any handgun.

North Carolina
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes


North Carolina: State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a permit from law enforcement prior to purchasing a handgun. The permit only involves a background check - no safety training or fingerprints are required. Law enforcement may take up to 30 days for the background check on the permit applicant. The permit is valid for five years. A separate handgun permit must be acquired for each handgun purchase, CCW permit holders are exempt from this requirement.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Partial

North Carolina: State law requires handgun buyers to first obtain a handgun permit. Law enforcement may take up to 30 days to process the permit and run a background check. The permit is valid for five years, but may only be used to purchase one handgun - to buy another handgun an individual must secure another permit. There is no state waiting period on rifle or shotgun sales.


Rhode Island
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? Yes

State law requires handgun buyers to obtain a license from law enforcement prior to purchasing a handgun. The handgun buyer must either take a safety course or pass a written safety test. No fingerprints are required.

snip..

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires a 7-day waiting period for all handgun sales.


South Dakota
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

WAITING PERIOD

Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires a 48-hour waiting period for all handgun sales by federally licensed dealers.


Washington
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

WAITING PERIOD

Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Partial

Washington: State law requires a 5-day waiting period for all handgun sales by federally licensed dealers unless local law enforcement completes a background check and approves a sale in less time. The 5-day period is used by law enforcement to run a criminal background check to make sure the handgun buyer is not prohibited from acquiring firearms. The 5-day period can be extended up to 60 days for new state residents.


Wisconsin
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence

WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? Yes

State law requires a 48-hour waiting period for all handgun sales by federally licensed dealers.
 
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Laws which are already thoroughly unconstitutional, and violations of the principle that a free man may go armed if he so chooses-- as a citizen, his arms are an extension of the lawful defense of his community.

I am tired of hearing so-called "gun rights" advocates defending these immoral laws-- as if they are any less illegal and unacceptable than the new laws that they are fighting against.
I agree. The only exception that I can see as proper would be that of those who have committed a violent felony, the only way this can be considered proper is that they.....through their own actions have forfeited some of their rights and due process laws can be sufficient to dole out those forfeitures, reinstateable, of course, upon clemency or likewise through the due process of our constitutional laws.
 
I don't know if you are using satire, or are serious. You are more extreme than I am; I understand the purpose of keeping hand grenades, automatic weapons, plastic explosives and bazookas out of the hands of the average person; after all, even highly trained military men and women have accidents with such dangerous weapons.

I agree that plastic explosives and hand grenades ought to be subject to licensing. Automatic weapons, however, are within the modern definition of "arms" as standard infantry equipment and are thus the legal standard for citizen militia use.

I do believe there have to be certain limitations to those Constitutional rights. Are you a member of NRA? Do you realize they are the ONLY organization that constantly fights against these 2nd amendment intrusions.

The only thing the NRA does is consistently argue that we should have "better enforcement" of the existing infringements of the American citizen's right to keep and bear arms.

When I have money to give, I prefer to give it to the Gun Owners of America, and those groups which actively advocate arming American citizens for their own protection-- particularly the JPFO and the Pink Pistols.

I may not be gay or Jewish, but I understand that a group that openly promotes Americans owning, training in, and carrying weapons for personal defense is going to do more for my gun rights than an organization which is primarily concerned with protecting sporting weapons.

If you are not a member, I recommend buying a membership if only to keep them funded to protect your rights; they are the ONLY organization doing so.

On the contrary, they are not the only organization doing so-- and I would prefer giving money to organizations that support gun rights directly, instead of merely channeling funds into GOP coffers.

I agree. The only exception that I can see as proper would be that of those who have committed a violent felony...

They should not be allowed weapons while they are serving their sentence. However, once they have served their sentence and are deemed fit to be released back into free society, aren't they supposedly free citizens once again? Haven't they "paid their debt"?

No, I absolutely disagree with allowing the government to deny fundamental civil rights to ex-convicts. It allows lawmakers to use the criminal justice system as a weapon to disenfranchise their political opponents, particularly among minorities and the poor.

This is precisely what we have seen with the War on Drugs, and the number of minor offenses that have been deemed "felonies" by the States and Federal government.

... through their own actions have forfeited some of their rights and due process laws can be sufficient to dole out those forfeitures, reinstateable, of course, upon clemency or likewise through the due process of our constitutional laws.

If we allow any citizen to forfeit their right to due process "by their own actions", we enable the government to strip any of us of those rights at any time, by declaring otherwise lawful and orderly actions to be "felonies" and "criminal offenses".
 
They should not be allowed weapons while they are serving their sentence. However, once they have served their sentence and are deemed fit to be released back into free society, aren't they supposedly free citizens once again? Haven't they "paid their debt"?
Fair enough, but the thing that bothers me is that they have already shown the tendancy to armed criminal behavior. Then again, banning them from owning weapons of any sort doesn't seem to work. Yikes, you've got me cornered on this one! Maybe have an independent board to revue re-instatement of rights.

No, I absolutely disagree with allowing the government to deny fundamental civil rights to ex-convicts. It allows lawmakers to use the criminal justice system as a weapon to disenfranchise their political opponents, particularly among minorities and the poor.
That is definitely something I have considered to be a problem with the current system myself.

This is precisely what we have seen with the War on Drugs, and the number of minor offenses that have been deemed "felonies" by the States and Federal government.
I could go on all day about the idiotic nature of the current drug prohibition in this country.



If we allow any citizen to forfeit their right to due process "by their own actions", we enable the government to strip any of us of those rights at any time, by declaring otherwise lawful and orderly actions to be "felonies" and "criminal offenses".
Good point, we protect all rights by ensuring those of people we disagree with. There are no easy answers with this subject.
 
I agree that plastic explosives and hand grenades ought to be subject to licensing. Automatic weapons, however, are within the modern definition of "arms" as standard infantry equipment and are thus the legal standard for citizen militia use.

I have no problem with this assuming these people are part of a civilian militia as as such are part of the civilian militia's rules and if they break it they are subject to the fullest extent of state law.

Those that aren't part of said militia though have no reason to have the same caliber as militias though if they are not part of a militia.
 
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Well, I know I'd certainly love being a resident of Chicago and having my taxes go to the mayor having a tissy fit and refusing to acknowledge the highest court in the land

:roll:

People have forgotten all to much that they're public SERVENTS
You know actually Chicago's laws are null and void according to the Supreme Court?
 
I have no problem with this assuming these people are part of a civilian militia as as such are part of the civilian militia's rules and if they break it they are subject to the fullest extent of state law.

Those that aren't part of said militia though have no reason to have the same caliber as militias though if they are not part of a militia.
Who isn't part of the militia?
 
Orius wrote.
Quote
(so if the Mayor is smart, he will simply make rules about what type of gun are permissible. Ban the kinds that can be concealed.)

Now if this Mayor is REALLY SMART, he will permit Potato guns and Water Pistols BUT place a blanket ban on all other firearm weapons.

People who want to ban honest people owning guns are usually those most needing of being shot by honest people
 
Anyone who isn't registered in the militia.

This is false. By federal law, which has not to my knowledge been stripped from the books, the "militia" is every male citizen aged 18 to 45 who is not otherwise exempted.

In Wyoming, State law extends this to 70.
 
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